I've looked through the archives and haven't found this subject
raised in the past, so...
As I plan my kitchen upgrade, I've been building some drawer units
for my workbench as prototypes and to gain experience with drawer
construction, face frame construction, and carcase construction (using
sheet goods).
One of the things I did with the storage drawers was use the "door
lip bit" that came with my Freud cabinet cutter set. What surprised me
was the fact that this lip cutter actually makes a lip allowing the door
or drawer front to inset into the cabinet face frame.
Sideways ASCII art: (rotate 90 degrees for actual orientation
-----------+ +--------------- Face frame
| |
| +----------------+ |
------------+/ \+--------------
+= =+
| | Drawer front (Note inset
+----------------------+ into face frame)
From looking at houses and other kitchen cabinets in home centers, I
have never seen this construction anywhere else. All of the
construction I recall seeing has the drawer front and/or door front
flush with the front of the face frame and profiled.
Has anyone built their kitchen cabinets using this kind of door and
drawer face consctruction? One potential issue I see is making sure
that the overlap opening is sufficiently sized to allow for seasonal
wood movement. Another question that comes to mind is that this appears
to have a greater potential for the drawer front to break at the edge if
the drawer or door are shut with too much force.
The final question I have is, would this make the construction look
less professional or somewhat "cheesy"?
In article <[email protected]>,
[email protected] says...
> Mark & Juanita <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > As I plan my kitchen upgrade, I've been building some drawer units
> >for my workbench as prototypes and to gain experience with drawer
> >construction, face frame construction, and carcase construction (using
> >sheet goods).
>
> This is what I keep telling my wife I'm doing... Maybe I'll finish the
> shop cabinets in 4-5 years, then I can start on the in-house projects.
>
Good luck. :-)
>
> > One of the things I did with the storage drawers was use the "door
> >lip bit" that came with my Freud cabinet cutter set. What surprised me
> >was the fact that this lip cutter actually makes a lip allowing the door
> >or drawer front to inset into the cabinet face frame.
>
> You never heard of Truth In Advertising?
>
Yes, but when I read "door lip", my thought (silly as it was) was
toward the profiles that are present on most current doors and drawers,
putting a profile on the inside face with a roundover on the outside
face, but leaving a flush mount.
> Lipped drawers and drawers are not popular in current styles, but I
> think they probably do a better job of keeping dust out of cabinets
> and drawers than either flush or full overlay doors, making them
> well-suited to a wood shop.
>
I agree with the above, and I do think that this design is probably
better than flush mount. My concern is whether, if I ever need to sell
the house, others would discount the value.
I'm also going to have to experiment with doors and Blum hinges to
determine whether this will be a problem.
Thanks to everyone who has provided input thus far.
That method of making doors was/is around until maybe the
late 88/89 in my part of the world. I built my present home
in 1988 and that form of doors was the method used by the
entire industry at that time. The "Euro" doors were just
starting to make a showing but didn't kick in big time till
a couple years later.
My mother-in-law refaced her cabinets last year and the doors
were exactly the same, except her's were made in 1965....
The "semi-euro" is the current rage.....
Mark & Juanita wrote:
> I've looked through the archives and haven't found this subject
> raised in the past, so...
>
> As I plan my kitchen upgrade, I've been building some drawer units
> for my workbench as prototypes and to gain experience with drawer
> construction, face frame construction, and carcase construction (using
> sheet goods).
>
> One of the things I did with the storage drawers was use the "door
> lip bit" that came with my Freud cabinet cutter set. What surprised me
> was the fact that this lip cutter actually makes a lip allowing the door
> or drawer front to inset into the cabinet face frame.
>
> Sideways ASCII art: (rotate 90 degrees for actual orientation
>
>
> -----------+ +--------------- Face frame
> | |
> | +----------------+ |
> ------------+/ \+--------------
> += =+
> | | Drawer front (Note inset
> +----------------------+ into face frame)
>
>
> From looking at houses and other kitchen cabinets in home centers, I
> have never seen this construction anywhere else. All of the
> construction I recall seeing has the drawer front and/or door front
> flush with the front of the face frame and profiled.
>
> Has anyone built their kitchen cabinets using this kind of door and
> drawer face consctruction? One potential issue I see is making sure
> that the overlap opening is sufficiently sized to allow for seasonal
> wood movement. Another question that comes to mind is that this appears
> to have a greater potential for the drawer front to break at the edge if
> the drawer or door are shut with too much force.
>
> The final question I have is, would this make the construction look
> less professional or somewhat "cheesy"?
>
On Fri, 02 Jan 2004 16:18:10 +0000, Mark & Juanita wrote:
> The final question I have is, would this make the construction look
> less professional or somewhat "cheesy"?
It's not "cheesy", but more like "retro". It was *the* method in the
'40sand '50s. My mothers house was built in 1903 and the kitchen
"upgraded" in 1946. The custom built cabinets are exactly how you
describe them with an exposed roundover on the outside lip. Generally,
all the doors and drawers have about 1/8" clearance between the face
frames and inside lip/drawer side.
-Doug
I build all my stuff like this. You can bury 3/16" of slop with the
overhang! I'd never live long enough to make flush doors look good with the
homemade lumber I use. I think the full overlays look junky and unfinished.
About 15 doors and 20 drawers so far and still more to go!
Wilson
"Mark & Juanita" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> I've looked through the archives and haven't found this subject
> raised in the past, so...
>
> As I plan my kitchen upgrade, I've been building some drawer units
> for my workbench as prototypes and to gain experience with drawer
> construction, face frame construction, and carcase construction (using
> sheet goods).
>
> One of the things I did with the storage drawers was use the "door
> lip bit" that came with my Freud cabinet cutter set. What surprised me
> was the fact that this lip cutter actually makes a lip allowing the door
> or drawer front to inset into the cabinet face frame.
>
> Sideways ASCII art: (rotate 90 degrees for actual orientation
>
>
> -----------+ +--------------- Face frame
> | |
> | +----------------+ |
> ------------+/ \+--------------
> += =+
> | | Drawer front (Note inset
> +----------------------+ into face frame)
>
>
> From looking at houses and other kitchen cabinets in home centers, I
> have never seen this construction anywhere else. All of the
> construction I recall seeing has the drawer front and/or door front
> flush with the front of the face frame and profiled.
>
> Has anyone built their kitchen cabinets using this kind of door and
> drawer face consctruction? One potential issue I see is making sure
> that the overlap opening is sufficiently sized to allow for seasonal
> wood movement. Another question that comes to mind is that this appears
> to have a greater potential for the drawer front to break at the edge if
> the drawer or door are shut with too much force.
>
> The final question I have is, would this make the construction look
> less professional or somewhat "cheesy"?
>
I redone the wife's kitchen a couple years back with all oak cabinets and
drawer and door faces. The old cabinets were made that way, "72ish I
believe. I did the new ones in a 3/8 or so overlay. I wish I had done the
"lipped" style. There's a few dammits! the old way would have covered up.
Next one's I do will be the "lipped" way. My $.02.
--
"Cartoons don't have any deep meaning.
They're just stupid drawings that give you a cheap laugh."
Homer Simpson
Jerry© The Phoneman®
"Mark & Juanita" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> In article <[email protected]>,
> [email protected] says...
> > Mark & Juanita <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> > > As I plan my kitchen upgrade, I've been building some drawer units
> > >for my workbench as prototypes and to gain experience with drawer
> > >construction, face frame construction, and carcase construction (using
> > >sheet goods).
> >
> > This is what I keep telling my wife I'm doing... Maybe I'll finish the
> > shop cabinets in 4-5 years, then I can start on the in-house projects.
> >
>
> Good luck. :-)
>
> >
> > > One of the things I did with the storage drawers was use the "door
> > >lip bit" that came with my Freud cabinet cutter set. What surprised me
> > >was the fact that this lip cutter actually makes a lip allowing the
door
> > >or drawer front to inset into the cabinet face frame.
> >
> > You never heard of Truth In Advertising?
> >
>
> Yes, but when I read "door lip", my thought (silly as it was) was
> toward the profiles that are present on most current doors and drawers,
> putting a profile on the inside face with a roundover on the outside
> face, but leaving a flush mount.
>
> > Lipped drawers and drawers are not popular in current styles, but I
> > think they probably do a better job of keeping dust out of cabinets
> > and drawers than either flush or full overlay doors, making them
> > well-suited to a wood shop.
> >
>
> I agree with the above, and I do think that this design is probably
> better than flush mount. My concern is whether, if I ever need to sell
> the house, others would discount the value.
>
> I'm also going to have to experiment with doors and Blum hinges to
> determine whether this will be a problem.
>
> Thanks to everyone who has provided input thus far.
>
Currently it is very much a trait of the Mexican "cabinet maker's" in this
neck of the woods. Still ubiquitous on many of the less expensive, built-in,
mostly plywood doors with wood trim, kitchen and bathroom cabinets in new
home construction.
High dollar cabinets around are currently characterized by wood face frames,
a 3/8" overlay solid wood door, with hidden euro hinges.
... but these things change like your socks.
--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 12/29/03
"Mark & Juanita" wrote in message
> The final question I have is, would this make the construction look
> less professional or somewhat "cheesy"?
"Mark & Juanita" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> I've looked through the archives and haven't found this subject
> raised in the past, so...
>
> As I plan my kitchen upgrade, I've been building some drawer units
> for my workbench as prototypes and to gain experience with drawer
> construction, face frame construction, and carcase construction (using
> sheet goods).
>
> One of the things I did with the storage drawers was use the "door
> lip bit" that came with my Freud cabinet cutter set. What surprised me
> was the fact that this lip cutter actually makes a lip allowing the door
> or drawer front to inset into the cabinet face frame.
>
> Sideways ASCII art: (rotate 90 degrees for actual orientation
>
>
> -----------+ +--------------- Face frame
> | |
> | +----------------+ |
> ------------+/ \+--------------
> += =+
> | | Drawer front (Note inset
> +----------------------+ into face frame)
>
>
> From looking at houses and other kitchen cabinets in home centers, I
> have never seen this construction anywhere else. All of the
> construction I recall seeing has the drawer front and/or door front
> flush with the front of the face frame and profiled.
>
> Has anyone built their kitchen cabinets using this kind of door and
> drawer face consctruction? One potential issue I see is making sure
> that the overlap opening is sufficiently sized to allow for seasonal
> wood movement. Another question that comes to mind is that this appears
> to have a greater potential for the drawer front to break at the edge if
> the drawer or door are shut with too much force.
>
> The final question I have is, would this make the construction look
> less professional or somewhat "cheesy"?
>
Funny you should mention this idea, when I made drawers for my shop, I
wasn't to worried about how they looked as long as they were strong and
functional. But as I made a simple full face drawer to sit against the face
frame, I realized the draws didn't sit quite right, the wobbled a little
when closed. So I took the face off the drawers, cut a rabbit around the
edge, so that the face fit into the draw openings. Drawers sit nice and
tight now.
Then when I looked back at some old pictures of my Father making cabinets
for the house I grew up in, his drawer faces were all cut the same way, with
a little rounding over effect on the edges, and that was before he bought
any router.
Dave
Mark & Juanita <[email protected]> wrote:
> As I plan my kitchen upgrade, I've been building some drawer units
>for my workbench as prototypes and to gain experience with drawer
>construction, face frame construction, and carcase construction (using
>sheet goods).
This is what I keep telling my wife I'm doing... Maybe I'll finish the
shop cabinets in 4-5 years, then I can start on the in-house projects.
> One of the things I did with the storage drawers was use the "door
>lip bit" that came with my Freud cabinet cutter set. What surprised me
>was the fact that this lip cutter actually makes a lip allowing the door
>or drawer front to inset into the cabinet face frame.
You never heard of Truth In Advertising?
Lipped drawers and drawers are not popular in current styles, but I
think they probably do a better job of keeping dust out of cabinets
and drawers than either flush or full overlay doors, making them
well-suited to a wood shop.