clamps

In article <[email protected]>, Larry Bud
<[email protected]> wrote:

> Annoying spam, but even more annoying is that your home page forwards
> you to ANOTHER page, which is annoying because I can't use the BACK
> button to exit your site. Tell your web developer he needs to fix
> this, cause I sure won't be back.

I certainly don't consider Brian's occasional posts to be spam, and the
back button works just fine in my browser (Safari 1.1.1).

Perhaps you should contact your browser developer and tell them they
need to fix it?

;-)

djb

--
There are no socks in my email address.

"Quando Omni Flunkus Moritati"

Larry Bud wrote:
> Of course it's spam, as he's offering nothing but advertising.
> Speaking as a web developer/java programmer, if you're going back
> fine, then your back button isn't actually going BACK to the previous
> page, as his home page forwards you to another page. You have to go
> back into the history if you really want to go back.

Spam is UNWANTED solicitation, so the message can be both depending on
who's reading it. Since Brian doesn't promote his website very often
he's well within the guidelines of promotions on this NG.

Dave in Fairfax
--
reply-to doesn't work
use:
daveldr at att dot net
American Association of Woodturners
Capital Area Woodturners

Larry Bud wrote:

> Of course it's spam, as he's offering nothing but advertising.
> Speaking as a web developer/java programmer, if you're going back
> fine, then your back button isn't actually going BACK to the previous
> page, as his home page forwards you to another page. You have to go
> back into the history if you really want to go back.

And what are you offering with this? And what am I advertising other
than my web site? A site that I do out of my own pocket and gain no
financial rewards for doing?

Brian

Greetings and Salutations....
On 2 Jan 2004 07:38:32 -0800, [email protected] (Larry Bud)
wrote:

>Brian Blazer <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
>> It always happens. You are right in the middle of a project and you find
>> out that you are short on clamps. So what do you do? You try to figure
>> out some sort of jerry rig with bailing wire and duct tape to get the
>> job done.
>
>Annoying spam, but even more annoying is that your home page forwards
>you to ANOTHER page, which is annoying because I can't use the BACK
>button to exit your site. Tell your web developer he needs to fix
>this, cause I sure won't be back.

Hum...since it IS a forum about woodworking (and I suppose has
some relevance to the boatbuilding community), I hardly would call
it spam as it IS on topic for the posted groups.
As for the "another page"...I can see your point, sort of...
However, the actions of the site stem from the fact that the pages
are not static, but, are generated on the fly by a database program.
Therefore, simply going to the domain (www.spaltedboard.com) causes
the web server to invoke the program to create the home page.
You CAN use the "back" button to get out...but, you DO
have to hit it twice in fairly quick sequence. The first "back"
gets you to the domain. The second "back" click gets you to the
page you were at when you went to the domain. It is a small
price to pay for a good source of information, I think, so,
perhaps the best thing we can do is all just chill out and worry
about more important things.
Regards
Dave Mundt

Brian Blazer <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> It always happens. You are right in the middle of a project and you find
> out that you are short on clamps. So what do you do? You try to figure
> out some sort of jerry rig with bailing wire and duct tape to get the
> job done.

Annoying spam, but even more annoying is that your home page forwards
you to ANOTHER page, which is annoying because I can't use the BACK
button to exit your site. Tell your web developer he needs to fix
this, cause I sure won't be back.

Dave Balderstone <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<020120040959402958%[email protected]>...
> In article <[email protected]>, Larry Bud
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > Annoying spam, but even more annoying is that your home page forwards
> > you to ANOTHER page, which is annoying because I can't use the BACK
> > button to exit your site. Tell your web developer he needs to fix
> > this, cause I sure won't be back.
>
> I certainly don't consider Brian's occasional posts to be spam, and the
> back button works just fine in my browser (Safari 1.1.1).
>
> Perhaps you should contact your browser developer and tell them they
> need to fix it?
>
> ;-)

Of course it's spam, as he's offering nothing but advertising.
Speaking as a web developer/java programmer, if you're going back
fine, then your back button isn't actually going BACK to the previous
page, as his home page forwards you to another page. You have to go
back into the history if you really want to go back.

In article <[email protected]>,
[email protected] says...
> Dan wrote:
> >some programmer has dropped the ball.
>
>
>
> The only real problem with most (OK, almost all) Web page
> "designers" is they think that onna 'count of the fact that
> they have some Web page software they are then Web page
> "designers". Would be sorta similar that anyone with word
> processing software would maybe think they were Ernest
> Hemingway.
>
Kinda like people that buy a brand X table saw for $1500 are
automatically "woodworkers" ?

On Fri 02 Jan 2004 02:41:32p, [email protected] (Larry Bud) wrote in
news:[email protected]:

> Of course it's spam, as he's offering nothing but advertising.

Promoting a woodworking website every now and then is spam? Tool reviews
and forums are "nothing but advertising?" I think maybe you and I differ on
the definition. :-)

> Speaking as a web developer/java programmer, if you're going back
> fine, then your back button isn't actually going BACK to the previous
> page, as his home page forwards you to another page. You have to go
> back into the history if you really want to go back.

Speaking as another web dev/programmer, my back button takes me right back
to the page I was on before I clicked on the link to spalted board. One
click. Always has, every time I visit the site. Same goes for a lot of
websites. If the back button takes the browser to the page that does the
redirect, some programmer has dropped the ball.

Dan

On Fri 02 Jan 2004 09:18:05p, Unisaw A100 <[email protected]> wrote in
news:[email protected]:

> UA100, who really thinks Web page "designers" might/oughta
> be gub'ment regulated or at the very least shot when seen in
> public...

Um. Did I uh, mention that I'm a programmer who makes sure the login goes
right and the right info comes out of the database, and the right pages
come up at the right time, and I don't really actually design websites? I
read the usability books and try to rig it so the user can get in there and
get what she wants without having to hunt all over for it, but I don't
actually, like, really, design. That's somebody else's job. They give me
templates and tell me what the font's supposed to be.

Oh, and since I technically work for the state, I guess I *am* gummint
regalated.

Dan

On Sat 03 Jan 2004 07:07:07a, Unisaw A100 <[email protected]> wrote in
news:[email protected]:

> Dan wrote:
>>They give me templates and tell me what the font's supposed to be.
>
> Yahbut, anyone ever tell you, "I want blinkies all over my
> page and make all the colors (colours David/Luigi) hot
> pink".?

Sigh. Yes. Then I try my best to tell the people who pay me what "Dancing
Baloney" is, and what "old eyes vs young eyes" is, as gently as I can. And
maybe explain the reasoning behind Section 508 as it applies to web-
accessible information. Actually I've learned to do that before they hand
me any specs. Often they'll say "um, we'll get back to you on that. Gotta
do a little revising."

> By the way, I'm really not totally on board with the, "But I
> was only following orders" argument. Sorry, I'm sure you're
> as pure as the freshly driven snow and all but we do have to
> make a yellow line in that freshly driven snow and "that"
> starts with you and me.

I'm obligated to point it out and try to persuade against it. Sometimes I
can actually point to gummint regs that forbid it because it has to be
available to sight-challenged and mouse-challenged users. But if the guy
who writes the check wants a pukey duck... well, I've got the specs - and
my recommendations against them - down in writing when somebody notices
it's a pukey duck and they try to point at me. :-)

The funny thing is, after I make my little speech sometimes they'll ask for
a different programmer because I "don't have the right attitude."
Supervisor had a chat with me a couple times. Supervisor stopped having
those chats when the clients started coming back to us to fix the gawdawful
crap they ended up with after they found somebody who gave 'em everything
they asked for without a fight. Now we've got clients who won't sign on
unless I'm on the team and if I'm booked up, they wait. If I can get my
woodworking close to that point, I'll be satisfied.

Hey. That was a rant, wasn't it?

And on that note, off I go to pack for two weeks on the Big Island hunting
for Koa wood. :-)
Dan

Dan wrote:
>I'm obligated to point it out and try to persuade against it. Sometimes I
>can actually point to gummint regs that forbid it because it has to be
>available to sight-challenged and mouse-challenged users.

ADA and Al Gore's Internet, I didn't know this.

>Hey. That was a rant, wasn't it?

It worked for me.

>And on that note, off I go to pack for two weeks on the Big Island hunting
>for Koa wood. :-)

Oh, I see. My first impressions of you were right.

rat bastard

UA100

Wrong..

"Larry Bud" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Brian Blazer <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:<[email protected]>...
> > It always happens. You are right in the middle of a project and you find
> > out that you are short on clamps. So what do you do? You try to figure
> > out some sort of jerry rig with bailing wire and duct tape to get the
> > job done.
>
> Annoying spam, but even more annoying is that your home page forwards
> you to ANOTHER page, which is annoying because I can't use the BACK
> button to exit your site. Tell your web developer he needs to fix
> this, cause I sure won't be back.

Dan wrote:
>They give me templates and tell me what the font's supposed to be.

Yahbut, anyone ever tell you, "I want blinkies all over my
page and make all the colors (colours David/Luigi) hot
pink".?

By the way, I'm really not totally on board with the, "But I
was only following orders" argument. Sorry, I'm sure you're
as pure as the freshly driven snow and all but we do have to
make a yellow line in that freshly driven snow and "that"
starts with you and me.

>Oh, and since I technically work for the state, I guess I *am* gummint
>regalated.

There now, we have our yellow line.

OBWW: If Web page designers were wooddorkers they'd be
making pukey ducks.

UA100, who thinks Web page designers are the mullets of the
design industry.

Dan wrote:
>some programmer has dropped the ball.



The only real problem with most (OK, almost all) Web page
"designers" is they think that onna 'count of the fact that
they have some Web page software they are then Web page
"designers". Would be sorta similar that anyone with word
processing software would maybe think they were Ernest
Hemingway.

UA100, who really thinks Web page "designers" might/oughta
be gub'ment regulated or at the very least shot when seen in
public...

KS wrote:
>Kinda like people that buy a brand X table saw for $1500 are
>automatically "woodworkers" ?


Ahhhh, you're catching on but there are some subtle nuances.
The trust funded beginner hobbyist wooddorker typically
doesn't turn right around and pawn themselves off to the
unsuspecting public as "professional" wooddorkers.

UA100

On Sat, 03 Jan 2004 22:38:20 -0000, Dan <[email protected]> brought
forth from the murky depths:

>On Sat 03 Jan 2004 07:07:07a, Unisaw A100 <[email protected]> wrote in
>news:[email protected]:
>
>> Dan wrote:
>>>They give me templates and tell me what the font's supposed to be.
>>
>> Yahbut, anyone ever tell you, "I want blinkies all over my
>> page and make all the colors (colours David/Luigi) hot
>> pink".?
>
>Sigh. Yes. Then I try my best to tell the people who pay me what "Dancing
>Baloney" is, and what "old eyes vs young eyes" is, as gently as I can. And

Some people just have to have animations distracting their clients
from the sales pitch they just spent a mint to produce, huh? <sigh>
I'm starting to make some money from small Flash movies but I'm still
telling people that less is more/subtlety COUNTS!


>maybe explain the reasoning behind Section 508 as it applies to web-
>accessible information. Actually I've learned to do that before they hand
>me any specs. Often they'll say "um, we'll get back to you on that. Gotta
>do a little revising."

I work with smaller companies and seldom get them to allow initial
revisions. Fortunately, most of them let me make corrections before
the site goes live, but they've spent more money than they had to.
I stopped being gentle, too. Tough love works better, though my pocket
would be bulging more if I let them ruin their sites by giving them
what they wanted.


>The funny thing is, after I make my little speech sometimes they'll ask for
>a different programmer because I "don't have the right attitude."
>Supervisor had a chat with me a couple times. Supervisor stopped having
>those chats when the clients started coming back to us to fix the gawdawful
>crap they ended up with after they found somebody who gave 'em everything
>they asked for without a fight. Now we've got clients who won't sign on
>unless I'm on the team and if I'm booked up, they wait. If I can get my
>woodworking close to that point, I'll be satisfied.

There ya go. I had one client look elsewhere when I wouldn't do a
site precisely as he wanted it, without spell or grammar-checking
in the slightest. After pointing out why I wouldn't do that, he went
away. About 2 months later, he came back and let me spellcheck it
and make a few mods. Over the course of the past six months, he has
spent about triple what I originally quoted to do the site correctly
for him and it still isn't pulling like it could. The customer is
(almost) always right, though.

Some day we'll find clients with both brains and bank accounts so we
can create the sites the right way the first time, eh?


>Hey. That was a rant, wasn't it?
>
>And on that note, off I go to pack for two weeks on the Big Island hunting
>for Koa wood. :-)

I'm sorry, sir, but I believe that Koa is out of season 365 days a
year unless you get really, really lucky and find some old stock
somewhere. (Kinda like Brazilian Rosewood.)

P.S: Hey, Keets. You'll never see flashing text or pukey ducks from
my office or shop.


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