Hi all. I am about to a bunch of drawers and want to dovetail them. There
are a bunch of jigs out there and also the Router Table Fence systems (Incra,
JointTech). What do you use and why? Would you do anything different now?
ANy suggestions would be great. I don't have a great router table but don't
want to spend $400 if a $70 jig will work as well. Anyone try the new Jet Jig?
Thanks.
Tom P.
I was at the Hamilton, Canada woodworking show last year and watched a
dovetail demo by Rob Cosman of Lie Nielsen. When he was finished with the
demo he had people from the audience try to cut a dovetail with various saws
he had. Some of the saws he had were fairly expensive but not one person
could cut a straight line with the other saws. When they tried the Lie
Nielsen saw they had perfectly straight cuts the first try. How good are
your dovetails with he $17 saw?
Rob gave me the sample he created and I can assure you that there isn't a
machine in the world that could create a better fitting dovetail
"tmbg" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> mortise gauge: $30
> bevel gauge: $9
> try square: $12
> dovetail saw: $17
>
> satisfaction of cutting beautiful dovetails by hand:
>
> priceless
>
> On Sun, 25 Jan 2004 16:20:21 +0000, Tom Prestia wrote:
>
> > Hi all. I am about to a bunch of drawers and want to dovetail them.
There
> > are a bunch of jigs out there and also the Router Table Fence systems
(Incra,
> > JointTech). What do you use and why? Would you do anything different
now?
> > ANy suggestions would be great. I don't have a great router table but
don't
> > want to spend $400 if a $70 jig will work as well. Anyone try the new
Jet Jig?
> >
> > Thanks.
> >
> > Tom P.
>
Just another example of how tools don't make up for lack of knowledge no
matter how expensive they are. To be frank, I don't do any better work with
my cabinet saw than I did with my contractor saw, eventually I will, but I
suspect the reason will be experience.
Don
Dave <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> I would never expect a sales rep to do anything like that ;-)
> Also, the vender of one the saws he was comparing top had a HUGE booth at
> the show. I would think they would have said something if he was lying.
> He took the name off the competitor's saw but it was no secret whose it
was.
snip
I was also at the competitors booth where a
> salesman was doing a little demo on dovetail's and I bet a 10 year old
could
> have produced better dovetails. I can't imagine anyone buying a saw by
> watching the results he got from using it. Obviously, in the hands of an
> expert, that saw would have produced amazing dovetails
tmbg wrote:
>
> mortise gauge: $30
> bevel gauge: $9
> try square: $12
> dovetail saw: $17
>
> satisfaction of cutting beautiful dovetails by hand:
>
> priceless
>
And when you get those tools (though I'm not sure about
the $17 dovetail saw) here's a set of instructions,
based mainly on Frank Klausz's dovetail video, with a
little Ian Kirby along with some suggestions by users
(thanks folks). Download, print at your leisure, take
a page or two to the shop, do what you see and so on.
www.wood-workers.com/users/charlieb/DovetailDrawer0.html
If you've got more than five or six drawers to do and
they're in ply do the lock miter joint discussed in
an earlier thread. That'll require a router table and
some fence/bit height tweeking but once set up you can
cut the four joints for each drawer in under two minutes.
charlie b
Uh Scott,
Do you have a LN saw? I'm curious because I have the hammered cheapies, and
while they do reasonably well, they just don't measure up to the LN. Maybe
my hammer needs to be calibrated so I can do it properly.
My LN is far superior to any saw I've picked up except for the Adria. There
is a lot going on with these saws besides set and appearance. It is
expensive, but cheap compared to the dovetail jigs on the market and it will
be an heirloom after I pass. :-)
It also does a great job of cutting mortise shoulders. If you can afford
one, you probably will enjoy having it.
OBTW, I do sharpen my LN myself.
"Scott Post" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:l56Rb.153557$xy6.739338@attbi_s02...
> In article <%[email protected]>,
>>
> The reason the LN was the only saw to cut straight was because it's one
> of the few western style dovetail saws that comes from the factory with
> minimal set. 30 seconds with a hammer and piece of steel knocking the
> set out and the $17 saw will cut just as straight as the Lie Nielsen.
> The LN will be sharper so it will cut faster but it won't cut any
> straighter. If you want to cut fast you can have the $17 saw sharpened
> or screw up the courage to do it yourself.
>
> The LN will definately look nicer though.
>
> --
> Scott Post [email protected]
http://home.insightbb.com/~sepost/
AN invaluable tool is the book "The Compleat Dovetail" by Ian Kirby. I had
the fortune (or Misfortune, depending on your take on Ian) of taking a
dovetail course from him... one Saturday and I was making really nice
through dovetails. A little more practice and half-lap dovetails were
astonishingly easy.
Find a course to take, or get a book (not necessarily this one) and
practice, practice practice... BEFORE YOU RUIN A PERFECTLY GOOD PIECE OF
CHERRY OR MAHOGANY.
Don Sforza
"Tom Prestia" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Hi all. I am about to a bunch of drawers and want to dovetail them.
There
> are a bunch of jigs out there and also the Router Table Fence systems
(Incra,
> JointTech). What do you use and why? Would you do anything different
now?
> ANy suggestions would be great. I don't have a great router table but
don't
> want to spend $400 if a $70 jig will work as well. Anyone try the new Jet
Jig?
>
> Thanks.
>
> Tom P.
In article <[email protected]>, Han <[email protected]> wrote:
>tmbg <[email protected]> wrote in news:pan.2004.01.25.17.34.13.729938
>@flurble.com:
>
>> mortise gauge: $30
>> bevel gauge: $9
>> try square: $12
>> dovetail saw: $17
>
>Could you fill in the brand/website of these items as you have them or
>would recommend? For those of us who can't distinguish between the many
>items that may be called one or the other of the above, such as me, a
>newbie in most respects.
>
You can get all of the above at Lee Valley Tools: www. leevalley.com
--
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)
How come we choose from just two people to run for president and 50 for Miss America?
tmbg <[email protected]> wrote in news:pan.2004.01.25.17.34.13.729938
@flurble.com:
> mortise gauge: $30
> bevel gauge: $9
> try square: $12
> dovetail saw: $17
Could you fill in the brand/website of these items as you have them or
would recommend? For those of us who can't distinguish between the many
items that may be called one or the other of the above, such as me, a
newbie in most respects.
> satisfaction of cutting beautiful dovetails by hand:
>
> priceless
>
shameless plug for plastic ... <grin>
--
Best regards
Han
email address is invalid
You don't suppose the other saws had their sets off a bit do you? Nah, that
just wouldn't be right. A rep from one company trying to impress everyone to
buy his saw wouldn't bring all the competitors' saws in unable to cut
straight, would he? No, no, no that just wouldn't happen. Sales reps are
much more honest and ethical than that. I guess the only saw produced that
is able to cut straight must be the one he demo'd that coincidently was the
one he wanted you to buy. Hmm, figure the odds of that.
--
Larry C in Auburn, WA
"Dave" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:%[email protected]...
> I was at the Hamilton, Canada woodworking show last year and watched a
> dovetail demo by Rob Cosman of Lie Nielsen. When he was finished with
the
> demo he had people from the audience try to cut a dovetail with various
saws
> he had. Some of the saws he had were fairly expensive but not one person
> could cut a straight line with the other saws. When they tried the Lie
> Nielsen saw they had perfectly straight cuts the first try. How good
are
> your dovetails with he $17 saw?
>
> Rob gave me the sample he created and I can assure you that there isn't a
> machine in the world that could create a better fitting dovetail
>
>
> "tmbg" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> > mortise gauge: $30
> > bevel gauge: $9
> > try square: $12
> > dovetail saw: $17
> >
> > satisfaction of cutting beautiful dovetails by hand:
> >
> > priceless
> >
> > On Sun, 25 Jan 2004 16:20:21 +0000, Tom Prestia wrote:
> >
> > > Hi all. I am about to a bunch of drawers and want to dovetail them.
> There
> > > are a bunch of jigs out there and also the Router Table Fence systems
> (Incra,
> > > JointTech). What do you use and why? Would you do anything different
> now?
> > > ANy suggestions would be great. I don't have a great router table but
> don't
> > > want to spend $400 if a $70 jig will work as well. Anyone try the new
> Jet Jig?
> > >
> > > Thanks.
> > >
> > > Tom P.
> >
>
>
I guess I'll go ahead and be the first jig user to chime in here. Not that
theres anything wrong with cutting them by hand, I'm just offering another
angle here. I recently bought and used the Jet half blind jig and it worked
flawlessly throughout the construction of 24 drawer boxes. It took me about
1/2 an hour out of the box to get it tuned in and after that I have not
touched a single adjustment. If you are in need of more information I can
post pictures of the results for you. I did these in cheapo 1/2" birch ply
from the Borg. Tried to explain to the customer the difference in this ply
and quality cabinet grade stuff but they wouldnt go for it so I was left
using the cheap stuff. Anyway it worked ok with the exception of some
tearout once or twice which honestly I think was because I was rushing it a
bit near the end of 48 operations! I also experimented with variable spacing
and got great results. By shifting the pin board in the jig you can get some
cool variations of the dovetail layout.
Jim
"Don Sforza" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> AN invaluable tool is the book "The Compleat Dovetail" by Ian Kirby. I had
> the fortune (or Misfortune, depending on your take on Ian) of taking a
> dovetail course from him... one Saturday and I was making really nice
> through dovetails. A little more practice and half-lap dovetails were
> astonishingly easy.
>
> Find a course to take, or get a book (not necessarily this one) and
> practice, practice practice... BEFORE YOU RUIN A PERFECTLY GOOD PIECE OF
> CHERRY OR MAHOGANY.
>
> Don Sforza
>
> "Tom Prestia" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> > Hi all. I am about to a bunch of drawers and want to dovetail them.
> There
> > are a bunch of jigs out there and also the Router Table Fence systems
> (Incra,
> > JointTech). What do you use and why? Would you do anything different
> now?
> > ANy suggestions would be great. I don't have a great router table but
> don't
> > want to spend $400 if a $70 jig will work as well. Anyone try the new
Jet
> Jig?
> >
> > Thanks.
> >
> > Tom P.
>
>
tmbg <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> mortise gauge: $30
> bevel gauge: $9
> try square: $12
> dovetail saw: $17
>
> satisfaction of cutting beautiful dovetails by hand:
>
> priceless
>
Or if you want to take the NORMal approach:
"Mastering Woodworking Machines" by Mark Duginske: $22
Wood and hardware for table saw jig: $5 (and about 1 hour labor)
Being able to quickly cut quality dovetails on your tablesaw:
Priceless
-Chris
In article <%[email protected]>,
Dave <[email protected]> wrote:
>I was at the Hamilton, Canada woodworking show last year and watched a
>dovetail demo by Rob Cosman of Lie Nielsen. When he was finished with the
>demo he had people from the audience try to cut a dovetail with various saws
>he had. Some of the saws he had were fairly expensive but not one person
>could cut a straight line with the other saws. When they tried the Lie
>Nielsen saw they had perfectly straight cuts the first try. How good are
>your dovetails with he $17 saw?
>
The reason the LN was the only saw to cut straight was because it's one
of the few western style dovetail saws that comes from the factory with
minimal set. 30 seconds with a hammer and piece of steel knocking the
set out and the $17 saw will cut just as straight as the Lie Nielsen.
The LN will be sharper so it will cut faster but it won't cut any
straighter. If you want to cut fast you can have the $17 saw sharpened
or screw up the courage to do it yourself.
The LN will definately look nicer though.
--
Scott Post [email protected] http://home.insightbb.com/~sepost/
mortise gauge: $30
bevel gauge: $9
try square: $12
dovetail saw: $17
satisfaction of cutting beautiful dovetails by hand:
priceless
On Sun, 25 Jan 2004 16:20:21 +0000, Tom Prestia wrote:
> Hi all. I am about to a bunch of drawers and want to dovetail them. There
> are a bunch of jigs out there and also the Router Table Fence systems (Incra,
> JointTech). What do you use and why? Would you do anything different now?
> ANy suggestions would be great. I don't have a great router table but don't
> want to spend $400 if a $70 jig will work as well. Anyone try the new Jet Jig?
>
> Thanks.
>
> Tom P.
I buy all my 'snobby woodworker's tools' at Highland Hardware. I'm
blessed by having them in town here :) All of the below they carry, at
about those prices, and all made by Crown. Crown stuff is fancy and nice,
all rosewood and brass. You can get cheaper stuff, and probably wont
affect the quality of work you turn out in most cases, but there's
definitely something to be said for spending a little extra and getting
something pretty.
For laying out dovetails, I use a Crown deluxe mortise gauge to scribe
shoulder lines, a 4" sliding bevel gauge, 4" try square, and marking knife
to lay out the pin board, an 8" dovetail saw to cut along the layout
lines, a set of Narex chisels to remove waste, and then I use the pin
board and the marking knife to layout the tail board, cut the pins, chisel
out the waste, and fit the joint. With a little practice, you can make
dovetails quickly that fit tight. I recently built a small bedstand with
4 drawers, and dovetailed all the drawers. It was a lot of work, but
worth it.
Here's a pic of my dovetail tools. I started with a 9" try square and a
7" bevel, but the tiny counterparts are much better for small work.
http://www.usedforcomparison.com/tools.jpg
On Sun, 25 Jan 2004 18:41:58 +0000, Han wrote:
> tmbg <[email protected]> wrote in news:pan.2004.01.25.17.34.13.729938
> @flurble.com:
>
>> mortise gauge: $30
>> bevel gauge: $9
>> try square: $12
>> dovetail saw: $17
>
> Could you fill in the brand/website of these items as you have them or
> would recommend? For those of us who can't distinguish between the many
> items that may be called one or the other of the above, such as me, a
> newbie in most respects.
>
>> satisfaction of cutting beautiful dovetails by hand:
>>
>> priceless
>>
> shameless plug for plastic ... <grin>
I'm sure it's not the most fantastic saw ever conceived, but it gets the
job done. And, I might have paid $25 for it, I can't remember.
It cuts straight lines just fine! I took the lacquer off the blade and
took a tiny bit of the set off the teeth, and it cuts just as nice as can
be. Woodworking doesn't HAVE to cost a fortune :P
On Sun, 25 Jan 2004 18:03:00 -0500, Dave wrote:
> I was at the Hamilton, Canada woodworking show last year and watched a
> dovetail demo by Rob Cosman of Lie Nielsen. When he was finished with the
> demo he had people from the audience try to cut a dovetail with various saws
> he had. Some of the saws he had were fairly expensive but not one person
> could cut a straight line with the other saws. When they tried the Lie
> Nielsen saw they had perfectly straight cuts the first try. How good are
> your dovetails with he $17 saw?
>
> Rob gave me the sample he created and I can assure you that there isn't a
> machine in the world that could create a better fitting dovetail
>
>
> "tmbg" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> mortise gauge: $30
>> bevel gauge: $9
>> try square: $12
>> dovetail saw: $17
>>
>> satisfaction of cutting beautiful dovetails by hand:
>>
>> priceless
>>
>> On Sun, 25 Jan 2004 16:20:21 +0000, Tom Prestia wrote:
>>
>> > Hi all. I am about to a bunch of drawers and want to dovetail them.
> There
>> > are a bunch of jigs out there and also the Router Table Fence systems
> (Incra,
>> > JointTech). What do you use and why? Would you do anything different
> now?
>> > ANy suggestions would be great. I don't have a great router table but
> don't
>> > want to spend $400 if a $70 jig will work as well. Anyone try the new
> Jet Jig?
>> >
>> > Thanks.
>> >
>> > Tom P.
>>
In article <[email protected]>,
Lowell Holmes <[email protected]> wrote:
>Uh Scott,
>Do you have a LN saw? I'm curious because I have the hammered cheapies, and
>while they do reasonably well, they just don't measure up to the LN. Maybe
>my hammer needs to be calibrated so I can do it properly.
>
>My LN is far superior to any saw I've picked up except for the Adria.
Actually, I have the Independence from Pete Taran and Patrick Leach from
before they sold out to Lie Nielsen. I believe it's stamped serial #12.
I've also tried an Adria.
They're both great saws but someone on a budget could do just as well with a
cheapie and a bit of work. I knocked the set out of a piece of junk from
Woodcraft that I probably paid about $12 for and it cuts just as straight
as my good saw. Not as fast, but just as straight. If I was ambitious
enough to take a file to it I could have it cutting just as fast also,
but it's not worth the work - it's only used for carpentry type jobs.
A cheapie can be made to cut just as well, but will certainly never look
as nice.
--
Scott Post [email protected] http://home.insightbb.com/~sepost/
I would never expect a sales rep to do anything like that ;-)
Also, the vender of one the saws he was comparing top had a HUGE booth at
the show. I would think they would have said something if he was lying.
He took the name off the competitor's saw but it was no secret whose it was.
I am sure there are many people who read this newsgroup that have been to a
Rob Cosman seminar. Has anyone checked the other saws to see if they have
been altered?
I didn't buy a saw and I didn't do the demo so I can only go by the
volunteer's samples. I was also at the competitors booth where a
salesman was doing a little demo on dovetail's and I bet a 10 year old could
have produced better dovetails. I can't imagine anyone buying a saw by
watching the results he got from using it. Obviously, in the hands of an
expert, that saw would have produced amazing dovetails
"Larry C in Auburn, WA" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:bwlRb.124707$5V2.651226@attbi_s53...
> You don't suppose the other saws had their sets off a bit do you? Nah,
that
> just wouldn't be right. A rep from one company trying to impress everyone
to
> buy his saw wouldn't bring all the competitors' saws in unable to cut
> straight, would he? No, no, no that just wouldn't happen. Sales reps are
> much more honest and ethical than that. I guess the only saw produced
that
> is able to cut straight must be the one he demo'd that coincidently was
the
> one he wanted you to buy. Hmm, figure the odds of that.
> --
> Larry C in Auburn, WA
>
> "Dave" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:%[email protected]...
> > I was at the Hamilton, Canada woodworking show last year and watched a
> > dovetail demo by Rob Cosman of Lie Nielsen. When he was finished with
> the
> > demo he had people from the audience try to cut a dovetail with various
> saws
> > he had. Some of the saws he had were fairly expensive but not one
person
> > could cut a straight line with the other saws. When they tried the Lie
> > Nielsen saw they had perfectly straight cuts the first try. How good
> are
> > your dovetails with he $17 saw?
> >
> > Rob gave me the sample he created and I can assure you that there isn't
a
> > machine in the world that could create a better fitting dovetail
> >
> >
> > "tmbg" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> > news:[email protected]...
> > > mortise gauge: $30
> > > bevel gauge: $9
> > > try square: $12
> > > dovetail saw: $17
> > >
> > > satisfaction of cutting beautiful dovetails by hand:
> > >
> > > priceless
> > >
> > > On Sun, 25 Jan 2004 16:20:21 +0000, Tom Prestia wrote:
> > >
> > > > Hi all. I am about to a bunch of drawers and want to dovetail
them.
> > There
> > > > are a bunch of jigs out there and also the Router Table Fence
systems
> > (Incra,
> > > > JointTech). What do you use and why? Would you do anything
different
> > now?
> > > > ANy suggestions would be great. I don't have a great router table
but
> > don't
> > > > want to spend $400 if a $70 jig will work as well. Anyone try the
new
> > Jet Jig?
> > > >
> > > > Thanks.
> > > >
> > > > Tom P.
> > >
> >
> >
>