I. SOME FREQUENTLY ASKED QUESTIONS ON WOOD:
Q: A Softwood is a soft wood and a Hardwood is a hard wood. Right?
A: False. A softwood is the wood of a conifer (or a Ginkgo), a hardwood is
the wood of a dicot tree. The hardest hardwood is some three times as hard
as the hardest softwood, but the hardest softwood is some four times as hard
as the softest hardwood. The softest woods in the world are hardwoods.
Q: A Conifer, that is the same thing as a Gymnosperm. Right?
A: Not quite: there are four groups of Gymnosperms, of which the Conifers
(with some six hundred species) are the biggest and most important. Ginkgo
(one species) is another such group. The remaining two groups don't yield
anything that could be regarded as timber.
Q: A wood with "cedar" in the name will surely be a softwood. Right?
A: False: "cedar" is a word that does not mean anything except a wood with a
certain type of fragrance (if that). Going only by frequency, "cedar" in the
US most often will be "Western Redcedar" (Thuja plicata), followed at some
distance by "Eastern Redcedar" (Juniperus virginiana) also marketed as
"Aromatic Cedar" [these are both softwoods]. A "cedar" from Central America
will usually be a Cedrela species; from SE Asia usually a Toona species
[these are both hardwoods]. Etc, etc [list goes on at considerable length].
Q: Slow-grown wood is harder than fast-grown wood. Right?
A: By and large, this is true. It will depend on the wood concerned. The
age-old canon is "A slow-grown softwood is harder than a fast-grown
softwood, while a fast-grown hardwood is harder than a slow-grown hardwood."
Curiously, this is also true, up to a point. It will not be true in the
tropics, but will in most of the US and Europe.
The point is that throughout most of the US and Europe the most used
hardwoods will be ring-porous (such as Ash, Elm, Hickory, Oak). A
ring-porous tree will start every year by forming a ring of very big pores
(easily visible to the naked eye) and only make mechanical tissue (for
support) later in the year. This means that in a short season the tree will
not have time to make a full growth ring, but stops after making only very
little of this mechanical tissue: slow-grown wood exists mostly of the rings
of big pores. As pores are big air-filled spaces slow-grown ring-porous
hardwood is quite soft. In a long season the tree will have the time to make
a full growth ring with a great deal of mechanical tissue. As the latter is
hard, a fast-grown ring-porous hardwood will be hard and strong.
For softwoods and diffuse-porous (non-ring-porous) hardwoods a
slow-grown wood will be harder (and more decorative) than a fast-grown wood.
Q: "Cherry" is the wood from the Cherry tree. Right?
A: Not really. The tree that cherries grow on does yield a classic wood,
called cherry, but this has always been fairly rare (these days cherry trees
are planted in a stunted form for pickability of the fruit). There is a US
timber tree ("Black Cherry", more or less closely related) that yields a
look-alike wood almost as good, and certainly a lot more available. This is
called cherry for convenience.
Q: "Brazilian Cherry "is a kind of cherry. Right?
A: False. The nearest wellknown relatives of "Brazilian Cherry" (Hymenaea),
more properly known as "Red Locust" or "Jatoba", will be Purpleheart
(Peltogyne) and Bubinga (Guibourtia). The closest relatives in the US will
be "Honey Locust" (Gleditsia) and the "Kentucky Coffetree" (Gymnocladus). A
(much) more distant relative is "Black Locust" (Robinia).
Q: What wood to use for a cutting board?
A: Maple, or something similar (any lightcolored hardwood, with a high
density and a fine structure, e.g. beech, birch, etc). Not to be recommended
are exotic hardwoods: their high degree of durability is because they
contain significant concentrations of exotic substances lethal to lots of
organisms. These substances are best avoided in food. The issue is
especially relevant when cooking for guests or children.
Q: A Live Oak is an oak that has not been cut down yet. Right?
A: False. A Live Oak is another name for an evergreen oak. Evergreen oaks
occur where the temperature allows, in a belt all round the world. Going by
the wood, there are three categories of genuine Oak (Quercus), found all
over the Northern Hemisphere: White Oaks, Red Oaks and Live Oaks. The woods
of these three are not closely comparable in any respect. Characters that
are shared by all three woods are prominent rays and a dendritic arrangement
of pores. All in all there are some 400 species of genuine Oak. In addition
there are any number of woods called Oak, for whatever reason strikes the
fancy of a wood trader.
Q: "Phillipine Mahogany" is mahogany from the Philippines. Right?
A: False. It may or may not be from the Philippines (probably not), but it
won't be Mahogany, ever.
Q: "Honduras Mahogany" is mahogany from Honduras. Right?
A: Depends. It could be, but usually is not (from Honduras, that is).
Q: "African Mahogany" is mahogany from Africa. Right?
A: Just about. The wood of Khaya is from tropical Africa and is usually
assumed to be a Mahogany.
Q: "Rhodesian Teak" is teak from Rhodesia. Right?
A: False. Baikiaea plurijuga is not teak, but a member of the Pea family. It
grows in several countries, one of which used to be called Rhodesia.
Q: "Nigerian Teak" is teak from Nigeria. Right?
A: Right. Plantation grown. Not that anybody would want to use it.
Q: "Java Teak" is teak from Java. Right?
A: Right. Plantation-grown, from the days the Dutch were there. High
quality.
Q: Teak is a really hard wood. Right?
A: Depends. Teak (Tectona grandis, family Labiatae) varies from soft as
butter and pale yellow to fairly hard and dark brown. Depends on provenance.
Q: Steel is stronger than wood. Right?
A: Depends. A piece of steel of a certain size will almost always be
stronger as a piece of wood the same size. A steel rod of a particular
length and mass as compared to a similarly sized rod of wood ...
Q: What is silica?
A: A mythical substance invoked by woodworkers whenever wood has a dulling
effect on tools. There is also real silica which occurs in about half (or
less) of the woods in which its presence is popularly assumed to occur.
* * *
II. SOME USEFUL SITES:
FPL:
- intro-page of the Forest Products Laboratory:
http://www2.fpl.fs.fed.us/
- technical properties of wood
http://www2.fpl.fs.fed.us/TechSheets/techmenu.html
including two downloadable books on US-Woods
- the FPL "Wood Handbook. Wood as an engineering material"
(downloadable):
http://www.fpl.fs.fed.us/documnts/fplgtr/fplgtr113/fplgtr113.htm
(Hardcopy at Lee Valley)
- common and scientific names of wood
(best database around, with a fairly low level of error):
http://www2.fpl.fs.fed.us/CommNames2000.html
- silvics of US trees
http://www.na.fs.fed.us/spfo/pubs/silvics_manual/table_of_contents.htm
or
http://www.fpl.fs.fed.us/tmu/publications.htm
OTHER SOURCES:
- "The American Woods":
(http://www.lib.ncsu.edu/archives/forestry/hough/
(pictures only; a similar set is now in print as "the Woodbook")
- lots of pictures (fun), but short on accuracy and real information
full version (slow):
http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/indextotal.htm
small version (faster):
http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/index.htm
Some more pictures (very little information; not free of typo's)
http://www.woodworking.org/WC/woodsampler.html
a preliminary page on purpleheart
(the wood of the genus Peltogyne, family Leguminosae):
http://www.organicsculpture.com/Purpleheart.html
a bird-eye's view of dangers:
http://www.city-net.com/albertfp/toxic.htm
http://www.ubeaut.com.au/badwood.htm
for a more extensive link-page see:
http://www.nehosoc.nl/paginalinks.htm
under reconstruction:
http://www.woodcollectors.org/
availability of wood (US)
http://www.woodfinder.com/
* * *
III. BOOKS:
Good entry-level books on wood are
"Good Wood Handbook" by Albert Jackson & David Day
(cheapest and best, just dropped out of print?)
"Woodworker's Guide to Wood" by Rick Peters ('passing grades')
An interesting book on a different way to obtain wood:
"Harvesting Urban Timber" by Sam Sherrill
Adult books on wood are
"Understanding Wood" by R. Bruce Hoadley
"Identifying Wood" by R. Bruce Hoadley
For those not shying away from a thick book:
"Holzatlas" by Rudi Wagenfuhr
P van Rijckevorsel wrote:
>
>
> Q: A Live Oak is an oak that has not been cut down yet. Right?
> A: False. A Live Oak is another name for an evergreen oak.
I have to disagree with you on that one. We have live and willow
oaks here in Maryland and they are not evergreen. There is also
a California live oak (which grows in California!) that looks
like a holly with acorns on it. It is evergreen.
--
FF
AAvK wrote:
> Mr. PvR can you help me identify a tree? It is an oak that
> grows in California in more arrid places, it's branches are
> real thick and "crooky" going in every direction in simple
> patterns from a short, fat trunk. The leaves are very small,
> about 1-1/2 inches long at the most, 3/4 inch wide, and a
> hard and dark green shiny surface. There are either 7 or 9
> very sharp and hard points sticking out of the edges,
> including the one that is straight out from the center, as a
> point on the tip of the leaf, hence the odd number of them.
>
> This tree is deciduous like crazy, but it is a very hard as a
> rock wood that is white to light grey with wide fat grain to
> finer outer grain and not soft at all. A lot of it winds-up to
> be firewood in California... I looked at Ca. oaks online
> anywhere I could find links but I cannot find this common
> tree. It is not blue oak nor is it black oak, do you know the
> regular and scientific names for it?
Sounds like California live oak to me.
--
FF
P van Rijckevorsel wrote:
> >
> ***
> _Quercus agrifolia_ looks like the prime candidate to me, too. See:
>
http://dlp.cs.berkeley.edu/cgi/img_query?query_src=photos_flora_sci&enlarge=
> 7335+3182+4653+0052
>
> However, California has twenty native species of oak.
> Leaf size and spinyness can vary even within one and the same tree.
> So, anything is possible. It is not unlikely that what is described
here as
> one widely occurring species is three or more species.
> PvR
I've read here on the rec that oaks readily hybridize in the wild,
Is this true of the Californai species?
--
FF
P van Rijckevorsel wrote:
> > P van Rijckevorsel wrote:
> > > Q: A Live Oak is an oak that has not been cut down yet. Right?
> > > A: False. A Live Oak is another name for an evergreen oak.
>
> > <[email protected]> schreef
> > I have to disagree with you on that one. We have live and willow
> > oaks here in Maryland and they are not evergreen.
>
> ***
> Willow oak is a white oak.
And by some reckoning live oak is a red oak.
Some divide oaks into two 'species groups', red and white.
Others divide oaks into four 'species groups', red, white, chestnut
oak, and live and willow oaks, grouping the live and willow oaks
together.
I've never seen anyone separate live oak from red and white, and
not spearate willow and chestnut oak at the same time, befor this
discussion.
Clearly how one chooses to bin them depends on largely subjective
choices as to how to weight their characteristics.
> Live oaks are not supposed to occur in Maryland but only up to
Virginia.
> Perhaps they behave atypically at the edge of the range, and beyond?
>
I had thought they were found well up into Pennsylvania. They are
definately found in the woods around Greenbelt, MD as well as being
popular in town. I have two small volunteers (currently without
leaves) in my back yard.
Maybe they were planted locally so long back in time that they have
spread to the woods outside of their natural range. Certainly the
biggest oaks in the woods are white or red oaks, I've only seen
live oaks among the younger parts of the woods where I'd estimate
the oldest trees are only 60 - 70 years old, but there are some
very big ones in town.
--
FF
I think the point that was being made was to avoid using a wood like
oleander for a cutting board.
I think stating that ALL woods are dangerous to eat also seems a bit
extreme. After all, a tree is just a plant and we eat plants all of the
time. Granted, there are toxic plants (and hence trees) but then we
don't eat all plants, just some of them.
Do you know of any studies that show comsuming wood is dangerous?
Jeff
JRYezierski wrote:
> Ignore the Q:What wood to use for cutting board?
> You can use exotics as a higlighter wood.
> ALL WOODS are dangerous to eat so the aurgument for not using them is
> streching the point. A person not not ingest anywood no matter what type it
> is.
> Use any tight grained hardwood,treat with a vigge/mineral oil and beeswax
> mixture and you will be alreight.
>
>>>Q: What wood to use for a cutting board?
>>>A: Maple, or something similar (any lightcolored hardwood, with a high
>>>density and a fine structure, e.g. beech, birch, etc). Not to be
>>>recommended
>>>are exotic hardwoods: their high degree of durability is because they
>>>contain significant concentrations of exotic substances lethal to lots of
>>>organisms. These substances are best avoided in food. The issue is
>>>especially relevant when cooking for guests or children.
> AAvK wrote:
> > Mr. PvR can you help me identify a tree? It is an oak that
> > grows in California in more arrid places, it's branches are
> > real thick and "crooky" going in every direction in simple
> > patterns from a short, fat trunk. The leaves are very small,
> > about 1-1/2 inches long at the most, 3/4 inch wide, and a
> > hard and dark green shiny surface. There are either 7 or 9
> > very sharp and hard points sticking out of the edges,
> > including the one that is straight out from the center, as a
> > point on the tip of the leaf, hence the odd number of them.
> >
> > This tree is deciduous like crazy, but it is a very hard as a
> > rock wood that is white to light grey with wide fat grain to
> > finer outer grain and not soft at all. A lot of it winds-up to
> > be firewood in California... I looked at Ca. oaks online
> > anywhere I could find links but I cannot find this common
> > tree. It is not blue oak nor is it black oak, do you know the
> > regular and scientific names for it?
<[email protected]> schreef
> Sounds like California live oak to me.
> FF
***
_Quercus agrifolia_ looks like the prime candidate to me, too. See:
http://dlp.cs.berkeley.edu/cgi/img_query?query_src=photos_flora_sci&enlarge=
7335+3182+4653+0052
However, California has twenty native species of oak.
Leaf size and spinyness can vary even within one and the same tree.
So, anything is possible. It is not unlikely that what is described here as
one widely occurring species is three or more species.
PvR
> P van Rijckevorsel wrote:
> > _Quercus agrifolia_ looks like the prime candidate to me, too. See:
http://dlp.cs.berkeley.edu/cgi/img_query?query_src=photos_flora_sci&enlarge=
7335+3182+4653+0052
> > However, California has twenty native species of oak.
> > Leaf size and spinyness can vary even within one and the same tree.
> > So, anything is possible. It is not unlikely that what is described
here as one widely occurring species is three or more species.
> > PvR
> <[email protected]> schreef
> I've read here on the rec that oaks readily hybridize in the wild,
> Is this true of the California species?
> FF
***
In California apparently more so than elsewhere.
PvR
> P van Rijckevorsel wrote:
> > Q: A Live Oak is an oak that has not been cut down yet. Right?
> > A: False. A Live Oak is another name for an evergreen oak.
> <[email protected]> schreef
> I have to disagree with you on that one. We have live and willow
> oaks here in Maryland and they are not evergreen.
***
Willow oak is a white oak.
Live oaks are not supposed to occur in Maryland but only up to Virginia.
Perhaps they behave atypically at the edge of the range, and beyond?
PvR
> > > P van Rijckevorsel wrote:
Q: A Live Oak is an oak that has not been cut down yet. Right?
A: False. A Live Oak is another name for an evergreen oak.
> > > <[email protected]> schreef
I have to disagree with you on that one. We have live and willow
oaks here in Maryland and they are not evergreen.
P van Rijckevorsel wrote:
> > Willow oak is a white oak.
> [email protected]> schreef
> And by some reckoning live oak is a red oak.
***
Oops, that was not right
Willow oak is a red oak
* * *
> Some divide oaks into two 'species groups', red and white.
> Others divide oaks into four 'species groups', red, white, chestnut
> oak, and live and willow oaks, grouping the live and willow oaks
> together.
> I've never seen anyone separate live oak from red and white, and
> not separate willow and chestnut oak at the same time, befor this
> discussion.
***
Well, chestnut oak is a white oak, that I am sure of.
As to what its scientific name should be is rather controversial.
I usually treat the oaks in three groups, red, white and live oaks, as those
are the groups I am seeing in the wood. Indeed they keep changing the number
of groups in the oak-genus, and I must admit I am not keeping up. Actually
there are a number of species that keep being in/excluded in/from Quercus. I
am not really that interested as long as there are a fair number of people
who vehemently disagree on the groupings. Oak taxonomists admit that it is
all very difficult. I did see the latest way of subdividing Quercus but I am
afraid I forgot about it as soon as I closed the book.
This should be one of the better treatments:
http://www.efloras.org/florataxon.aspx?flora_id=1&taxon_id=127839
BTW: They call Quercus virginana a "subevergreen" tree or shrub
* * *
> Clearly how one chooses to bin them depends on largely subjective
choices as to how to weight their characteristics.
***
It is a little more complicated than that, but certainly we are not out of
the woods yet
* * *
> > Live oaks are not supposed to occur in Maryland but only up to
Virginia.
> > Perhaps they behave atypically at the edge of the range, and beyond?
> I had thought they were found well up into Pennsylvania.
***
Not according to the books and the USDA website
http://plants.usda.gov/
* * *
> They are
> definately found in the woods around Greenbelt, MD as well as being
> popular in town. I have two small volunteers (currently without
> leaves) in my back yard.
***
Maybe they did not read the books ;-)
* * *
> Maybe they were planted locally so long back in time that they have
> spread to the woods outside of their natural range. Certainly the
> biggest oaks in the woods are white or red oaks, I've only seen
> live oaks among the younger parts of the woods where I'd estimate
> the oldest trees are only 60 - 70 years old, but there are some
> very big ones in town.
>
> --
>
> FF
>
dzine <[email protected]> schreef
> And to hopefully bring an end to what was a most brave attempt by P van
> Rijckevorsel (cut and paste) i believe in the UK we call the evergreen
> oak the Holm Oak.
***
Even that needs to be qualified a little.
A quick browse through my UK books shows:
If "Holm Oak" is used (formerly "Holme Oak"?) then it refers alway to
_Quercus ilex_ which obviously is the best-known evergreen oak in the UK.
However this species is sometimes referred to as Live Oak, in spite of the
fact that when Live Oak is used for a single species it will most usually
refer to _Quercus virginiana_. In the UK as well as as elsewhere "Live Oak"
is used to refer to the evergreen oaks in general.
Another wellknown Live (or evergreen) Oak is the Cork Oak
(_Quercus suber_), but there are plenty more, even in Europe.
PvR
Ignore the Q:What wood to use for cutting board?
You can use exotics as a higlighter wood.
ALL WOODS are dangerous to eat so the aurgument for not using them is
streching the point. A person not not ingest anywood no matter what type it
is.
Use any tight grained hardwood,treat with a vigge/mineral oil and beeswax
mixture and you will be alreight.
"Eddie Munster" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:9%[email protected]...
> That was fun reading. Thanks!
>
> John
>
>
>
>
> P van Rijckevorsel wrote:
>> I. SOME FREQUENTLY ASKED QUESTIONS ON WOOD:
>>
>> Q: A Softwood is a soft wood and a Hardwood is a hard wood. Right?
>> A: False. A softwood is the wood of a conifer (or a Ginkgo), a hardwood
>> is
>> the wood of a dicot tree. The hardest hardwood is some three times as
>> hard
>> as the hardest softwood, but the hardest softwood is some four times as
>> hard
>> as the softest hardwood. The softest woods in the world are hardwoods.
>>
>> Q: A Conifer, that is the same thing as a Gymnosperm. Right?
>> A: Not quite: there are four groups of Gymnosperms, of which the Conifers
>> (with some six hundred species) are the biggest and most important.
>> Ginkgo
>> (one species) is another such group. The remaining two groups don't yield
>> anything that could be regarded as timber.
>>
>> Q: A wood with "cedar" in the name will surely be a softwood. Right?
>> A: False: "cedar" is a word that does not mean anything except a wood
>> with a
>> certain type of fragrance (if that). Going only by frequency, "cedar" in
>> the
>> US most often will be "Western Redcedar" (Thuja plicata), followed at
>> some
>> distance by "Eastern Redcedar" (Juniperus virginiana) also marketed as
>> "Aromatic Cedar" [these are both softwoods]. A "cedar" from Central
>> America
>> will usually be a Cedrela species; from SE Asia usually a Toona species
>> [these are both hardwoods]. Etc, etc [list goes on at considerable
>> length].
>>
>> Q: Slow-grown wood is harder than fast-grown wood. Right?
>> A: By and large, this is true. It will depend on the wood concerned. The
>> age-old canon is "A slow-grown softwood is harder than a fast-grown
>> softwood, while a fast-grown hardwood is harder than a slow-grown
>> hardwood."
>> Curiously, this is also true, up to a point. It will not be true in the
>> tropics, but will in most of the US and Europe.
>> The point is that throughout most of the US and Europe the most used
>> hardwoods will be ring-porous (such as Ash, Elm, Hickory, Oak). A
>> ring-porous tree will start every year by forming a ring of very big
>> pores
>> (easily visible to the naked eye) and only make mechanical tissue (for
>> support) later in the year. This means that in a short season the tree
>> will
>> not have time to make a full growth ring, but stops after making only
>> very
>> little of this mechanical tissue: slow-grown wood exists mostly of the
>> rings
>> of big pores. As pores are big air-filled spaces slow-grown ring-porous
>> hardwood is quite soft. In a long season the tree will have the time to
>> make
>> a full growth ring with a great deal of mechanical tissue. As the latter
>> is
>> hard, a fast-grown ring-porous hardwood will be hard and strong.
>> For softwoods and diffuse-porous (non-ring-porous) hardwoods a
>> slow-grown wood will be harder (and more decorative) than a fast-grown
>> wood.
>>
>> Q: "Cherry" is the wood from the Cherry tree. Right?
>> A: Not really. The tree that cherries grow on does yield a classic wood,
>> called cherry, but this has always been fairly rare (these days cherry
>> trees
>> are planted in a stunted form for pickability of the fruit). There is a
>> US
>> timber tree ("Black Cherry", more or less closely related) that yields a
>> look-alike wood almost as good, and certainly a lot more available. This
>> is
>> called cherry for convenience.
>>
>> Q: "Brazilian Cherry "is a kind of cherry. Right?
>> A: False. The nearest wellknown relatives of "Brazilian Cherry"
>> (Hymenaea),
>> more properly known as "Red Locust" or "Jatoba", will be Purpleheart
>> (Peltogyne) and Bubinga (Guibourtia). The closest relatives in the US
>> will
>> be "Honey Locust" (Gleditsia) and the "Kentucky Coffetree" (Gymnocladus).
>> A
>> (much) more distant relative is "Black Locust" (Robinia).
>>
>> Q: What wood to use for a cutting board?
>> A: Maple, or something similar (any lightcolored hardwood, with a high
>> density and a fine structure, e.g. beech, birch, etc). Not to be
>> recommended
>> are exotic hardwoods: their high degree of durability is because they
>> contain significant concentrations of exotic substances lethal to lots of
>> organisms. These substances are best avoided in food. The issue is
>> especially relevant when cooking for guests or children.
>>
>> Q: A Live Oak is an oak that has not been cut down yet. Right?
>> A: False. A Live Oak is another name for an evergreen oak. Evergreen oaks
>> occur where the temperature allows, in a belt all round the world. Going
>> by
>> the wood, there are three categories of genuine Oak (Quercus), found all
>> over the Northern Hemisphere: White Oaks, Red Oaks and Live Oaks. The
>> woods
>> of these three are not closely comparable in any respect. Characters that
>> are shared by all three woods are prominent rays and a dendritic
>> arrangement
>> of pores. All in all there are some 400 species of genuine Oak. In
>> addition
>> there are any number of woods called Oak, for whatever reason strikes the
>> fancy of a wood trader.
>>
>> Q: "Phillipine Mahogany" is mahogany from the Philippines. Right?
>> A: False. It may or may not be from the Philippines (probably not), but
>> it
>> won't be Mahogany, ever.
>>
>> Q: "Honduras Mahogany" is mahogany from Honduras. Right?
>> A: Depends. It could be, but usually is not (from Honduras, that is).
>>
>> Q: "African Mahogany" is mahogany from Africa. Right?
>> A: Just about. The wood of Khaya is from tropical Africa and is usually
>> assumed to be a Mahogany.
>>
>> Q: "Rhodesian Teak" is teak from Rhodesia. Right?
>> A: False. Baikiaea plurijuga is not teak, but a member of the Pea family.
>> It
>> grows in several countries, one of which used to be called Rhodesia.
>>
>> Q: "Nigerian Teak" is teak from Nigeria. Right?
>> A: Right. Plantation grown. Not that anybody would want to use it.
>>
>> Q: "Java Teak" is teak from Java. Right?
>> A: Right. Plantation-grown, from the days the Dutch were there. High
>> quality.
>>
>> Q: Teak is a really hard wood. Right?
>> A: Depends. Teak (Tectona grandis, family Labiatae) varies from soft as
>> butter and pale yellow to fairly hard and dark brown. Depends on
>> provenance.
>>
>> Q: Steel is stronger than wood. Right?
>> A: Depends. A piece of steel of a certain size will almost always be
>> stronger as a piece of wood the same size. A steel rod of a particular
>> length and mass as compared to a similarly sized rod of wood ...
>>
>> Q: What is silica?
>> A: A mythical substance invoked by woodworkers whenever wood has a
>> dulling
>> effect on tools. There is also real silica which occurs in about half (or
>> less) of the woods in which its presence is popularly assumed to occur.
>>
>> * * *
>>
>> II. SOME USEFUL SITES:
>>
>> FPL:
>> - intro-page of the Forest Products Laboratory:
>> http://www2.fpl.fs.fed.us/
>>
>> - technical properties of wood
>> http://www2.fpl.fs.fed.us/TechSheets/techmenu.html
>> including two downloadable books on US-Woods
>>
>> - the FPL "Wood Handbook. Wood as an engineering material"
>> (downloadable):
>> http://www.fpl.fs.fed.us/documnts/fplgtr/fplgtr113/fplgtr113.htm
>> (Hardcopy at Lee Valley)
>>
>> - common and scientific names of wood
>> (best database around, with a fairly low level of error):
>> http://www2.fpl.fs.fed.us/CommNames2000.html
>>
>> - silvics of US trees
>> http://www.na.fs.fed.us/spfo/pubs/silvics_manual/table_of_contents.htm
>>
>> or
>> http://www.fpl.fs.fed.us/tmu/publications.htm
>>
>> OTHER SOURCES:
>> - "The American Woods":
>> (http://www.lib.ncsu.edu/archives/forestry/hough/
>> (pictures only; a similar set is now in print as "the Woodbook")
>>
>> - lots of pictures (fun), but short on accuracy and real information
>> full version (slow):
>> http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/indextotal.htm
>> small version (faster):
>> http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/index.htm
>>
>> Some more pictures (very little information; not free of typo's)
>> http://www.woodworking.org/WC/woodsampler.html
>>
>> a preliminary page on purpleheart
>> (the wood of the genus Peltogyne, family Leguminosae):
>> http://www.organicsculpture.com/Purpleheart.html
>>
>> a bird-eye's view of dangers:
>> http://www.city-net.com/albertfp/toxic.htm
>> http://www.ubeaut.com.au/badwood.htm
>>
>> for a more extensive link-page see:
>> http://www.nehosoc.nl/paginalinks.htm
>>
>> under reconstruction:
>> http://www.woodcollectors.org/
>>
>> availability of wood (US)
>> http://www.woodfinder.com/
>>
>> * * *
>>
>> III. BOOKS:
>> Good entry-level books on wood are
>> "Good Wood Handbook" by Albert Jackson & David Day
>> (cheapest and best, just dropped out of print?)
>> "Woodworker's Guide to Wood" by Rick Peters ('passing grades')
>>
>> An interesting book on a different way to obtain wood:
>> "Harvesting Urban Timber" by Sam Sherrill
>>
>> Adult books on wood are
>> "Understanding Wood" by R. Bruce Hoadley
>> "Identifying Wood" by R. Bruce Hoadley
>>
>> For those not shying away from a thick book:
>> "Holzatlas" by Rudi Wagenfuhr
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
That was fun reading. Thanks!
John
P van Rijckevorsel wrote:
> I. SOME FREQUENTLY ASKED QUESTIONS ON WOOD:
>
> Q: A Softwood is a soft wood and a Hardwood is a hard wood. Right?
> A: False. A softwood is the wood of a conifer (or a Ginkgo), a hardwood is
> the wood of a dicot tree. The hardest hardwood is some three times as hard
> as the hardest softwood, but the hardest softwood is some four times as hard
> as the softest hardwood. The softest woods in the world are hardwoods.
>
> Q: A Conifer, that is the same thing as a Gymnosperm. Right?
> A: Not quite: there are four groups of Gymnosperms, of which the Conifers
> (with some six hundred species) are the biggest and most important. Ginkgo
> (one species) is another such group. The remaining two groups don't yield
> anything that could be regarded as timber.
>
> Q: A wood with "cedar" in the name will surely be a softwood. Right?
> A: False: "cedar" is a word that does not mean anything except a wood with a
> certain type of fragrance (if that). Going only by frequency, "cedar" in the
> US most often will be "Western Redcedar" (Thuja plicata), followed at some
> distance by "Eastern Redcedar" (Juniperus virginiana) also marketed as
> "Aromatic Cedar" [these are both softwoods]. A "cedar" from Central America
> will usually be a Cedrela species; from SE Asia usually a Toona species
> [these are both hardwoods]. Etc, etc [list goes on at considerable length].
>
> Q: Slow-grown wood is harder than fast-grown wood. Right?
> A: By and large, this is true. It will depend on the wood concerned. The
> age-old canon is "A slow-grown softwood is harder than a fast-grown
> softwood, while a fast-grown hardwood is harder than a slow-grown hardwood."
> Curiously, this is also true, up to a point. It will not be true in the
> tropics, but will in most of the US and Europe.
> The point is that throughout most of the US and Europe the most used
> hardwoods will be ring-porous (such as Ash, Elm, Hickory, Oak). A
> ring-porous tree will start every year by forming a ring of very big pores
> (easily visible to the naked eye) and only make mechanical tissue (for
> support) later in the year. This means that in a short season the tree will
> not have time to make a full growth ring, but stops after making only very
> little of this mechanical tissue: slow-grown wood exists mostly of the rings
> of big pores. As pores are big air-filled spaces slow-grown ring-porous
> hardwood is quite soft. In a long season the tree will have the time to make
> a full growth ring with a great deal of mechanical tissue. As the latter is
> hard, a fast-grown ring-porous hardwood will be hard and strong.
> For softwoods and diffuse-porous (non-ring-porous) hardwoods a
> slow-grown wood will be harder (and more decorative) than a fast-grown wood.
>
> Q: "Cherry" is the wood from the Cherry tree. Right?
> A: Not really. The tree that cherries grow on does yield a classic wood,
> called cherry, but this has always been fairly rare (these days cherry trees
> are planted in a stunted form for pickability of the fruit). There is a US
> timber tree ("Black Cherry", more or less closely related) that yields a
> look-alike wood almost as good, and certainly a lot more available. This is
> called cherry for convenience.
>
> Q: "Brazilian Cherry "is a kind of cherry. Right?
> A: False. The nearest wellknown relatives of "Brazilian Cherry" (Hymenaea),
> more properly known as "Red Locust" or "Jatoba", will be Purpleheart
> (Peltogyne) and Bubinga (Guibourtia). The closest relatives in the US will
> be "Honey Locust" (Gleditsia) and the "Kentucky Coffetree" (Gymnocladus). A
> (much) more distant relative is "Black Locust" (Robinia).
>
> Q: What wood to use for a cutting board?
> A: Maple, or something similar (any lightcolored hardwood, with a high
> density and a fine structure, e.g. beech, birch, etc). Not to be recommended
> are exotic hardwoods: their high degree of durability is because they
> contain significant concentrations of exotic substances lethal to lots of
> organisms. These substances are best avoided in food. The issue is
> especially relevant when cooking for guests or children.
>
> Q: A Live Oak is an oak that has not been cut down yet. Right?
> A: False. A Live Oak is another name for an evergreen oak. Evergreen oaks
> occur where the temperature allows, in a belt all round the world. Going by
> the wood, there are three categories of genuine Oak (Quercus), found all
> over the Northern Hemisphere: White Oaks, Red Oaks and Live Oaks. The woods
> of these three are not closely comparable in any respect. Characters that
> are shared by all three woods are prominent rays and a dendritic arrangement
> of pores. All in all there are some 400 species of genuine Oak. In addition
> there are any number of woods called Oak, for whatever reason strikes the
> fancy of a wood trader.
>
> Q: "Phillipine Mahogany" is mahogany from the Philippines. Right?
> A: False. It may or may not be from the Philippines (probably not), but it
> won't be Mahogany, ever.
>
> Q: "Honduras Mahogany" is mahogany from Honduras. Right?
> A: Depends. It could be, but usually is not (from Honduras, that is).
>
> Q: "African Mahogany" is mahogany from Africa. Right?
> A: Just about. The wood of Khaya is from tropical Africa and is usually
> assumed to be a Mahogany.
>
> Q: "Rhodesian Teak" is teak from Rhodesia. Right?
> A: False. Baikiaea plurijuga is not teak, but a member of the Pea family. It
> grows in several countries, one of which used to be called Rhodesia.
>
> Q: "Nigerian Teak" is teak from Nigeria. Right?
> A: Right. Plantation grown. Not that anybody would want to use it.
>
> Q: "Java Teak" is teak from Java. Right?
> A: Right. Plantation-grown, from the days the Dutch were there. High
> quality.
>
> Q: Teak is a really hard wood. Right?
> A: Depends. Teak (Tectona grandis, family Labiatae) varies from soft as
> butter and pale yellow to fairly hard and dark brown. Depends on provenance.
>
> Q: Steel is stronger than wood. Right?
> A: Depends. A piece of steel of a certain size will almost always be
> stronger as a piece of wood the same size. A steel rod of a particular
> length and mass as compared to a similarly sized rod of wood ...
>
> Q: What is silica?
> A: A mythical substance invoked by woodworkers whenever wood has a dulling
> effect on tools. There is also real silica which occurs in about half (or
> less) of the woods in which its presence is popularly assumed to occur.
>
> * * *
>
> II. SOME USEFUL SITES:
>
> FPL:
> - intro-page of the Forest Products Laboratory:
> http://www2.fpl.fs.fed.us/
>
> - technical properties of wood
> http://www2.fpl.fs.fed.us/TechSheets/techmenu.html
> including two downloadable books on US-Woods
>
> - the FPL "Wood Handbook. Wood as an engineering material"
> (downloadable):
> http://www.fpl.fs.fed.us/documnts/fplgtr/fplgtr113/fplgtr113.htm
> (Hardcopy at Lee Valley)
>
> - common and scientific names of wood
> (best database around, with a fairly low level of error):
> http://www2.fpl.fs.fed.us/CommNames2000.html
>
> - silvics of US trees
> http://www.na.fs.fed.us/spfo/pubs/silvics_manual/table_of_contents.htm
>
> or
> http://www.fpl.fs.fed.us/tmu/publications.htm
>
> OTHER SOURCES:
> - "The American Woods":
> (http://www.lib.ncsu.edu/archives/forestry/hough/
> (pictures only; a similar set is now in print as "the Woodbook")
>
> - lots of pictures (fun), but short on accuracy and real information
> full version (slow):
> http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/indextotal.htm
> small version (faster):
> http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/index.htm
>
> Some more pictures (very little information; not free of typo's)
> http://www.woodworking.org/WC/woodsampler.html
>
> a preliminary page on purpleheart
> (the wood of the genus Peltogyne, family Leguminosae):
> http://www.organicsculpture.com/Purpleheart.html
>
> a bird-eye's view of dangers:
> http://www.city-net.com/albertfp/toxic.htm
> http://www.ubeaut.com.au/badwood.htm
>
> for a more extensive link-page see:
> http://www.nehosoc.nl/paginalinks.htm
>
> under reconstruction:
> http://www.woodcollectors.org/
>
> availability of wood (US)
> http://www.woodfinder.com/
>
> * * *
>
> III. BOOKS:
> Good entry-level books on wood are
> "Good Wood Handbook" by Albert Jackson & David Day
> (cheapest and best, just dropped out of print?)
> "Woodworker's Guide to Wood" by Rick Peters ('passing grades')
>
> An interesting book on a different way to obtain wood:
> "Harvesting Urban Timber" by Sam Sherrill
>
> Adult books on wood are
> "Understanding Wood" by R. Bruce Hoadley
> "Identifying Wood" by R. Bruce Hoadley
>
> For those not shying away from a thick book:
> "Holzatlas" by Rudi Wagenfuhr
>
>
>
>
>
Sounds similar to Gary Oak - evergreen , grows on the Islands, gnarly,
twisty and just plain rude to tourists.
If I can find a picture, I may post it for you to look at. I know I took
some of the Gary Oak. It sounds like the trees are at least first
cousins if not closer. :-)
Gary Oak are relatively small though. Of coarse anything looks small
when there is a W. Red Cedar near it. :-))
Patriarch wrote:
> Will <[email protected]> wrote in news:ozVOd.27359$Ub4.1258790
> @news20.bellglobal.com:
>
>
>>Gary Oak?
>>
>>Like the stuff that grows on the Gulf Islands? Or similar to it?
>>
>>AAvK wrote:
>>
>
> Valley oak. Beautiful tree. Not furniture or cabinet wood. Moves like
> crazy. Twists, checks, cracks, splits. Hard as heck to turn, due to
> movement and interlocking grain.
>
> These are considered heritage trees in their range, in suburban northern
> California. But when they come down, they can be deadly and/or
> expensive. Also susceptible to sudden oak death...
>
> www.diablowoodworkers.com will be doing a show this summer using wood
> from a particularly old tree that had to come down in Concord, CA 18
> months ago, as part of the 100 year celebration of the city. If I have
> time, I may have a small piece in the show.
>
> Patriarch
--
Will
Occasional Techno-geek
Mr. PvR can you help me identify a tree? It is an oak that
grows in California in more arrid places, it's branches are
real thick and "crooky" going in every direction in simple
patterns from a short, fat trunk. The leaves are very small,
about 1-1/2 inches long at the most, 3/4 inch wide, and a
hard and dark green shiny surface. There are either 7 or 9
very sharp and hard points sticking out of the edges,
including the one that is straight out from the center, as a
point on the tip of the leaf, hence the odd number of them.
This tree is deciduous like crazy, but it is a very hard as a
rock wood that is white to light grey with wide fat grain to
finer outer grain and not soft at all. A lot of it winds-up to
be firewood in California... I looked at Ca. oaks online
anywhere I could find links but I cannot find this common
tree. It is not blue oak nor is it black oak, do you know the
regular and scientific names for it?
--
Alex
cravdraa_at-yahoo_dot-com
not my site: http://www.e-sword.net/
Will <[email protected]> wrote in news:ozVOd.27359$Ub4.1258790
@news20.bellglobal.com:
> Gary Oak?
>
> Like the stuff that grows on the Gulf Islands? Or similar to it?
>
> AAvK wrote:
>> Mr. PvR can you help me identify a tree? It is an oak that
>> grows in California in more arrid places, it's branches are
>> real thick and "crooky" going in every direction in simple
>> patterns from a short, fat trunk. The leaves are very small,
>> about 1-1/2 inches long at the most, 3/4 inch wide, and a
>> hard and dark green shiny surface. There are either 7 or 9
>> very sharp and hard points sticking out of the edges,
>> including the one that is straight out from the center, as a
>> point on the tip of the leaf, hence the odd number of them.
>>
>> This tree is deciduous like crazy, but it is a very hard as a
>> rock wood that is white to light grey with wide fat grain to
>> finer outer grain and not soft at all. A lot of it winds-up to
>> be firewood in California... I looked at Ca. oaks online
>> anywhere I could find links but I cannot find this common
>> tree. It is not blue oak nor is it black oak, do you know the
>> regular and scientific names for it?
>>
>
Valley oak. Beautiful tree. Not furniture or cabinet wood. Moves like
crazy. Twists, checks, cracks, splits. Hard as heck to turn, due to
movement and interlocking grain.
These are considered heritage trees in their range, in suburban northern
California. But when they come down, they can be deadly and/or
expensive. Also susceptible to sudden oak death...
www.diablowoodworkers.com will be doing a show this summer using wood
from a particularly old tree that had to come down in Concord, CA 18
months ago, as part of the 100 year celebration of the city. If I have
time, I may have a small piece in the show.
Patriarch
> _Quercus agrifolia_ looks like the prime candidate to me, too. See:
> http://dlp.cs.berkeley.edu/cgi/img_query?query_src=photos_flora_sci&enlarge=
> 7335+3182+4653+0052
> However, California has twenty native species of oak.
> Leaf size and spinyness can vary even within one and the same tree.
> So, anything is possible. It is not unlikely that what is described here as
> one widely occurring species is three or more species.
> PvR
>
>
Thanks but I think that is not it... the leaves are darker green, smaller, harder
and shinier in a more definitive shape than that, with less spikes sticking out.
Between each point is a more evenly arched concave curve. The leaves in the
photo look softer and larger. Mine is a very crude tree.
--
Alex
cravdraa_at-yahoo_dot-com
not my site: http://www.e-sword.net/
Nice club site. Went through the projects. Some real talent in the club.
Patriarch wrote:
> Will <[email protected]> wrote in news:ozVOd.27359$Ub4.1258790
> @news20.bellglobal.com:
>
>
>>Gary Oak?
>>
>>Like the stuff that grows on the Gulf Islands? Or similar to it?
>>
>>AAvK wrote:
> www.diablowoodworkers.com will be doing a show this summer using wood
> from a particularly old tree that had to come down in Concord, CA 18
> months ago, as part of the 100 year celebration of the city. If I have
> time, I may have a small piece in the show.
>
> Patriarch
--
Will
Occasional Techno-geek
On Fri, 11 Feb 2005 23:29:38 +0100, the inscrutable "P van
Rijckevorsel" <[email protected]> spake:
>> > > P van Rijckevorsel wrote:
>Q: A Live Oak is an oak that has not been cut down yet. Right?
>A: False. A Live Oak is another name for an evergreen oak.
>
>> > > <[email protected]> schreef
>I have to disagree with you on that one. We have live and willow
>oaks here in Maryland and they are not evergreen.
We had live oaks everywhere in LoCal and they were evergreen.
Climate is everything.
>> They are
>> definately found in the woods around Greenbelt, MD as well as being
>> popular in town. I have two small volunteers (currently without
>> leaves) in my back yard.
>
>***
>Maybe they did not read the books ;-)
>* * *
Trees, being totally illiterate, are VERY bad in that manner.
But their grace easily makes up for it, don't you agree?
--
Vidi, Vici, Veni
---
http://diversify.com Comprehensive Website Development
Gary Oak?
Like the stuff that grows on the Gulf Islands? Or similar to it?
AAvK wrote:
> Mr. PvR can you help me identify a tree? It is an oak that
> grows in California in more arrid places, it's branches are
> real thick and "crooky" going in every direction in simple
> patterns from a short, fat trunk. The leaves are very small,
> about 1-1/2 inches long at the most, 3/4 inch wide, and a
> hard and dark green shiny surface. There are either 7 or 9
> very sharp and hard points sticking out of the edges,
> including the one that is straight out from the center, as a
> point on the tip of the leaf, hence the odd number of them.
>
> This tree is deciduous like crazy, but it is a very hard as a
> rock wood that is white to light grey with wide fat grain to
> finer outer grain and not soft at all. A lot of it winds-up to
> be firewood in California... I looked at Ca. oaks online
> anywhere I could find links but I cannot find this common
> tree. It is not blue oak nor is it black oak, do you know the
> regular and scientific names for it?
>
--
Will
Occasional Techno-geek
"JRYezierski" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
> Ignore the Q:What wood to use for cutting board?
> You can use exotics as a higlighter wood.
> ALL WOODS are dangerous to eat so the aurgument for not using them is streching the point. A person not not ingest anywood no
> matter what type it is.
> Use any tight grained hardwood,treat with a vigge/mineral oil and beeswax mixture and you will be alreight.
>
It's not about ingesting "the wood itself"... its the chemical in the
wood. You just don't use certain woods for salad bowls, even as dry.
--
Alex
cravdraa_at-yahoo_dot-com
not my site: http://www.e-sword.net/