Odd; Festool price display policy at Woodcraft- Baltimore

On Sat, 26 Feb 2011 16:40:39 -0600, dpb <[email protected]> wrote:

>On 2/26/2011 4:18 PM, [email protected] wrote:
>...
>
>> They could, yes. They'd rather charge it, though. In VT they cannot add it
>> indiscriminately. In for an ounce...
>
>I'd be _very_ surprised if the law actually refers to a dealer's "admin"
>fees outside of state-imposed fees as well.

They do. States have all sorts of silly "consumer protection" nonsense.

>As always, a reference to the applicable State Code section would clear
>up the confusion... :)

Go for it.

On Feb 26, 4:00=A0pm, "TimDrouillard" <[email protected]> wrote:
> FWIW, When I stopped by my local Woodcraft yesterday to purchase a Rotex =
125
> they gave me both a general Festool catalog, as well as the latest (2011)
> Master Price list.
>
> Not sure if the fact that the previous week I bought a Kapex , a CT36 as
> well as a MFT/3 had anything to do with it.
>
> Next week I'll stop by and get a PSB300 jigsaw (they were on order).
>


This one?

http://s123.photobucket.com/albums/o290/Robatoy/?action=3Dview&current=3DFe=
stoolFun.mp4

On Feb 25, 11:54=A0pm, -MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote:
> I walk out of stores that don't display prices.
> Whether it's wood, tools, or beer... I will not buy from a place that
> doesn't have prices near or on the merch.
>
> --
>
> =A0 -MIKE-
>
> =A0 "Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
> =A0 =A0 =A0--Elvin Jones =A0(1927-2004)
> =A0 --
> =A0http://mikedrums.com
> =A0 [email protected]
> =A0 ---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

About prices... a buddy of mine has a standard saying:
"If you've got to ask...fukkum."

On Feb 26, 1:07=A0am, Bill <[email protected]> wrote:
> -MIKE- wrote:
> > I walk out of stores that don't display prices.
> > Whether it's wood, tools, or beer... I will not buy from a place that
> > doesn't have prices near or on the merch.
>
> Yeah, most the used car dealers are like that around here. I feel the
> same way you do. One family of dealers won't even give you a price until
> they get your whole family medical history (slight exaggeration).
>
> Bill

That sounds like when I tried to patronize a local insurance agent
(State Farm). I went in to get a quote and was presented with a full-
page list of personal history that they "needed" to have. I said
"really?" and then left. It's almost as if some places don't really
want your business at all. Strange.

JP

On Feb 26, 4:27=A0pm, "TimDrouillard" <[email protected]> wrote:
> No, that's the PS 300 barrel grip jigsaw, I'm after the PSB 300 D-handle
> version.
>
I'm a barrel-grip guy. I find I'm more accurate with it and it works
better for me in awkward (upside-down) situations.
I do have both. A german made Milwaukee and a Bosch barrel grip.
Neither has any serious dust collection.

"Swingman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On 2/27/2011 3:04 PM, Leon wrote:
>
> I just walked out of the shop an hour or so ago after using my Bosch top
> handle and wishing the whole time I'd had the barrel grip.


Shold'a picked up one of those too. ;~)

No, that's the PS 300 barrel grip jigsaw, I'm after the PSB 300 D-handle
version.

"Robatoy" wrote in message
news:0c392fdf-3fdd-41b6-84b3-241ccced6562@a11g2000pro.googlegroups.com...

On Feb 26, 4:00 pm, "TimDrouillard" <[email protected]> wrote:
> FWIW, When I stopped by my local Woodcraft yesterday to purchase a Rotex
> 125
> they gave me both a general Festool catalog, as well as the latest (2011)
> Master Price list.
>
> Not sure if the fact that the previous week I bought a Kapex , a CT36 as
> well as a MFT/3 had anything to do with it.
>
> Next week I'll stop by and get a PSB300 jigsaw (they were on order).
>


This one?

http://s123.photobucket.com/albums/o290/Robatoy/?action=view&current=FestoolFun.mp4

On Sat, 26 Feb 2011 02:55:05 -0500, Bill <[email protected]> wrote:

>-MIKE- wrote:
>> On 2/26/11 12:07 AM, Bill wrote:
>>> -MIKE- wrote:
>>>> I walk out of stores that don't display prices.
>>>> Whether it's wood, tools, or beer... I will not buy from a place that
>>>> doesn't have prices near or on the merch.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Yeah, most the used car dealers are like that around here. I feel the
>>> same way you do. One family of dealers won't even give you a price until
>>> they get your whole family medical history (slight exaggeration).
>>>
>>> Bill
>>
>> I walked out on a car deal once, because after I had asked the guy for
>> the total amount it would cost so I could call my bank and ask about
>> payments, I came back and it was like $150 higher for administrative fees.
>>
>> I told him, "First of all, that's called overhead and it comes out of
>> your profit. Secondly, you had your chance to disclose that when I asked
>> the first time. You now have the chance to remove it or loss the sale."
>>
>
>Gosh maybe we're neighbors. I ran into that same $150 administrative fee
>twice (on my car and my wife's). I asked them point blank, "Are you
>trying to charge me for cashing my check?" Fee was waved both times. In
>the more interesting of the two cases, I was asked, "Do you want to
>speak to the manager about it?", I hesitated for a moment and then said
>yes, and she said, "Oh, he's out to lunch" and printed out a new bill of
>sale without batting an eye. Must be good commissions in that work...

When I lived in VT, I was very good friends with a GM of a Ford dealership.
When I questioned their "documentation fee" he said it was a requirement of
the state DMV that it must be the same for every sale. They can do whatever
they want with the selling price (e.g. subtract the doc fee) but the doc fee
*had* to be the same for all.

"Lee Michaels" wrote in message
news:[email protected]...


> Yep, there are a lot of websites out there that offer all kinds of
> information EXCEPT prices. I leave them immediately. I spend enormous
> amount of time on the web, both at work and at home. I don't have time to
> talk to shiny shoed salesman.

A lack of pricing is usually a bad sign if only because they want to make
you go through their whole sales pitch so by the time you find out the price
you're already hooked. Infomercials often use that approach.

> Same with all those sites who want me to "register". If I have to
> register to find out about your product or service, you must be selling
> crap. Or be a crook.

Or they want to pester you with spam for the next year, or sell your address
to seven other outfits that will spam you senseless.

> Honest people who offer good products and service don't have to conduct
> themselves like con men.

Sadly so much of the public chooses to buy crap from crooks that that
sometimes the good merchants have to play hardball just to keep the doors
open, by which I mean they have to get slicker and more aggressive in their
sales techniques (as opposed to selling crap or otherwise ripping off the
customer).

On Feb 26, 12:28=A0am, "Lee Michaels" <leemichaels*nadaspam* at comcast
dot net> wrote:
> "-MIKE-" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>
> news:[email protected]...> I walk out of stores tha=
t don't display prices.
> > Whether it's wood, tools, or beer... I will not buy from a place that
> > doesn't have prices near or on the merch.
>
> ---------
> Yep, there are a lot of websites out there that offer all kinds of
> information EXCEPT prices. =A0I leave them immediately. I spend enormous
> amount of time on the web, both at work and at home. I don't have time to
> talk to shiny shoed salesman.
>
> Same with all those sites who want me to "register". =A0If I have to regi=
ster
> to find out about your product or service, you must be selling crap. =A0O=
r be
> a crook.
>
> Honest people who offer good products and service don't have to conduct
> themselves like con men.

Amen, bro'!

"-MIKE-" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> I walk out of stores that don't display prices.
> Whether it's wood, tools, or beer... I will not buy from a place that
> doesn't have prices near or on the merch.
>
---------
Yep, there are a lot of websites out there that offer all kinds of
information EXCEPT prices. I leave them immediately. I spend enormous
amount of time on the web, both at work and at home. I don't have time to
talk to shiny shoed salesman.

Same with all those sites who want me to "register". If I have to register
to find out about your product or service, you must be selling crap. Or be
a crook.

Honest people who offer good products and service don't have to conduct
themselves like con men.

marc rosen wrote:
> Hey All,
> I stopped in my local (Baltimore) Woodcraft today and noticed
> that all of the Festool items had their price obliterated. When I
> asked if this was in anticipation of the March 1 price increase the
> sales dude told me no, it was a Festool policy not to display their
> prices. He related to me that there was one Festool vendor that had
> its "license" to sell Festool revoked because they displayed prices.
> He was not sure if that was another Woodcraft or a more independent
> vendor.
> The new Festool catalogue is also devoid of prices. This makes
> sense since they won't have "out of date" catalogues when they raise
> prices again but if the vendors can't display prices on the floor it
> will require potential customers to interact with the store staff
> (which may or may not be a desireable task).
> I do not know if this is national policy or if it is just limited
> to Woodfcraft, or if it is just the Woodcrafts owned by the local
> franchiser, but it seems counter productive to me. It disrupts my
> eagerness to buy stuff if I have to ask prices each time I contemplate
> buying something. I really doubt this is a nationwwide policy but
> maybe it is Festool's version of buying a yacht; If you have to ask
> how much it is, you really can't afford it.
> On a slightly different note I'm not that excited about the Rotex
> 90. Unless you really need a small diameter sander the larger
> Festools appear to have better balance. I have a Rotex 150 and it is
> very easy to keep the pad flat when only holding the barrel . The 90
> feels barrel heavy and I think you'd need to hold down on the head as
> well as the barrel. Still, maybe some day I will "need" that 3+ inch
> diameter pad for sanding something.
> If you are a Festool junkie I think you'll also be happy seeing
> the new catalogue. There are a couple new battery jigsaws and some
> new battery drills including an 18 volt. That's got to be an
> expensive drill based on their other models.
> Not much else to dwell on so I'll head back down to my shop.
> Hope you all have a productive - and safe - weekend in your shop too.
> Marc
>
I don't buy coffee at a place that does not display prices.

Places that do not show prices are always dearer.

On 2011-02-26 01:13:49 -0500, Bill <[email protected]> said:

> I have a Rockler and Woodcraft within driving distance. I think
> Rockler's prices are often about 25% more than Woodcraft's--which helps
> them complensate for all of those 20%-off coupons they send out every
> week. I'd rather they not sent the coupons, and just adjusted their
> pricing. Like some other posters here, I'm getting impatient with
> pricing "games".
>
> Bill in IN.

Odd -- we're talking about the same stores, but my perception is the
reverse. Starting buying primarily at Woodcraft, now generally shop
Rockler.

Woodcraft does have better depth in turning chisels (i.e., more than
just Sorby), including a decent house brand.

marc rosen wrote:
> Hey All,
> I stopped in my local (Baltimore) Woodcraft today and noticed
> that all of the Festool items had their price obliterated. When I
> asked if this was in anticipation of the March 1 price increase the
> sales dude told me no, it was a Festool policy not to display their
> prices. He related to me that there was one Festool vendor that had
> its "license" to sell Festool revoked because they displayed prices.
> He was not sure if that was another Woodcraft or a more independent
> vendor.

I would highly doubt his story Marc. That does not even make sense. Sounds
more like a cheap sales guy story.


> The new Festool catalogue is also devoid of prices. This makes
> sense since they won't have "out of date" catalogues when they raise
> prices again but if the vendors can't display prices on the floor it
> will require potential customers to interact with the store staff
> (which may or may not be a desireable task).

From a retail sales standpoint - that would be very desireable,
(interracting with the sales staff). It also makes sense that Festool does
not want the consumer to be aware of any price increases.


> I do not know if this is national policy or if it is just limited
> to Woodfcraft, or if it is just the Woodcrafts owned by the local
> franchiser, but it seems counter productive to me. It disrupts my
> eagerness to buy stuff if I have to ask prices each time I contemplate
> buying something. I really doubt this is a nationwwide policy but
> maybe it is Festool's version of buying a yacht; If you have to ask
> how much it is, you really can't afford it.

Maybe - who knows? There is a big difference between marketing to yacht
buyers and marketing to woodworkers at Woodcraft though. Perhaps they think
they can take commodity items like tools to a new level, and they really
only want to market to people like... Leon...



--

-Mike-
[email protected]

"Lee Michaels" <leemichaels*nadaspam* at comcast dot net> wrote
> Yep, there are a lot of websites out there that offer all kinds of
> information EXCEPT prices. I leave them immediately. I spend enormous
> amount of time on the web, both at work and at home. I don't have time to
> talk to shiny shoed salesman.
>
> Same with all those sites who want me to "register". If I have to
> register to find out about your product or service, you must be selling
> crap. Or be a crook.
>
> Honest people who offer good products and service don't have to conduct
> themselves like con men.

The only time no price is acceptable is when the manufacturer shows items
that will vary considerably by retailer, generally low end items. Even
major appliances show the "list" price so you have a starting point to talk
to the local retailers.

As for Festool, I wonder if they think asking will start a dialog with the
salesperson and eventually a sale. I've usually done my homework before
hitting the store so I know if I want to even look at an item before I get
there. With $100 in my pocket, no amount of interaction with a salesdude
will get me to buy a $400 sander.

On Feb 26, 1:07=A0am, Bill <[email protected]> wrote:
> -MIKE- wrote:
> > I walk out of stores that don't display prices.
> > Whether it's wood, tools, or beer... I will not buy from a place that
> > doesn't have prices near or on the merch.
>
> Yeah, most the used car dealers are like that around here. I feel the
> same way you do. One family of dealers won't even give you a price until
> they get your whole family medical history (slight exaggeration).
>
> Bill

Years ago, the local Ford dealer would make you sign a purchase
agreement with the price you wanted to pay before he'd take it in to
the manager. "You buy it first, then we talk money."
That didn't last too long.

"Bill" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Edward Hennessey wrote:
>> "marc rosen"<[email protected]> wrote in message
>> news:0ba0c836-0b58-4481-b69f-b0aaa543b7f8@o30g2000pra.googlegroups.com...
>>
>
> I have a Rockler and Woodcraft within driving distance. I think Rockler's
> prices are often about 25% more than Woodcraft's--which helps them
> complensate for all of those 20%-off coupons they send out every week.
> I'd rather they not sent the coupons, and just adjusted their pricing.
> Like some other posters here, I'm getting impatient with pricing "games".
>
> Bill in IN.


Strangly enough, Our Rockler seems at least 25 percent cheaper than our
Woodcraft. In Houston and we still get the good coupons.

"Edward Hennessey" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> When recently reviewing comments on the Bosch barrel grip, a hot hand
> after
> some use was the top complaint.

Wow I would have thought that would have been solved years ago with the
plastic bodies.

"TimDrouillard" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> No I have not actually used one yet. All the reviews I've read rate it
> quite highly. I don't recall any of the reviewers mentioning anything
> about having a problem with seeing the cut line nor the blade, but I'll be
> on the lookout for it now.
> The biggest complaint I've heard it with regards to the price.
>
> Thanks.


Give us a review! ;~)

FWIW, When I stopped by my local Woodcraft yesterday to purchase a Rotex 125
they gave me both a general Festool catalog, as well as the latest (2011)
Master Price list.

Not sure if the fact that the previous week I bought a Kapex , a CT36 as
well as a MFT/3 had anything to do with it.

Next week I'll stop by and get a PSB300 jigsaw (they were on order).

The salesman did tell me that they had a large order coming in this week and
that they were going to greatly expand the Festool display area.


"JayPique" wrote in message
news:[email protected]...

On Feb 26, 1:07 am, Bill <[email protected]> wrote:
> -MIKE- wrote:
> > I walk out of stores that don't display prices.
> > Whether it's wood, tools, or beer... I will not buy from a place that
> > doesn't have prices near or on the merch.
>
> Yeah, most the used car dealers are like that around here. I feel the
> same way you do. One family of dealers won't even give you a price until
> they get your whole family medical history (slight exaggeration).
>
> Bill

That sounds like when I tried to patronize a local insurance agent
(State Farm). I went in to get a quote and was presented with a full-
page list of personal history that they "needed" to have. I said
"really?" and then left. It's almost as if some places don't really
want your business at all. Strange.

JP

On 2/27/2011 3:04 PM, Leon wrote:
> "Robatoy"<[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> On Feb 27, 9:54 am, "Leon"<[email protected]> wrote:
>> "TimDrouillard"<[email protected]> wrote in message
>>
>> news:[email protected]...
>>
>>> No I have not actually used one yet. All the reviews I've read rate it
>>> quite highly. I don't recall any of the reviewers mentioning anything
>>> about having a problem with seeing the cut line nor the blade, but I'll
>>> be
>>> on the lookout for it now.
>>> The biggest complaint I've heard it with regards to the price.
>>
>>> Thanks.
>>
>> Give us a review! ;~)
>
> I can add one thing... there are times when either configuration works
> a little better, but if I were to have only ONE... it'd be a barrel
> grip.
> The barrel will rotate in your hand, 360°, in effect, it adds another
> axis.
>
> A while ago, I was cutting out a sink hole for a drop-in sink. The
> back side of the cut was under the windowsill and my top-handle
> Milwaukee wouldn't go under the sill for me to complete the cut. My
> Bosch 'just' made it under the sill. Caveat: One must remember that
> cutting in a direction that puts the side-mounted switch (on the
> Bosch) between the barrel and the wall makes shutting the saw off
> impossible.
>
> My preference is the top handle but mostly because when I was kid and was
> using my dad's barrel grip, the one with a metal exterior, the body got
> quite hot.

I just walked out of the shop an hour or so ago after using my Bosch top
handle and wishing the whole time I'd had the barrel grip.

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 4/15/2010
KarlC@ (the obvious)

On 2/25/2011 7:44 PM, marc rosen wrote:
> Hey All,
> I stopped in my local (Baltimore) Woodcraft today and noticed
> that all of the Festool items had their price obliterated. When I
> asked if this was in anticipation of the March 1 price increase the
> sales dude told me no, it was a Festool policy not to display their
> prices. He related to me that there was one Festool vendor that had
> its "license" to sell Festool revoked because they displayed prices.
> He was not sure if that was another Woodcraft or a more independent
> vendor.

Lame salesman BS? ... here's one of the most active Festool dealers in
the country:

http://bobmarinosbesttools.com/

That said, the dealers are apparently not allowed to disclose the new
prices in advance, which makes absolutely perfect sense.

Sounds like some dumb shit overreacted. The world is becoming full of 'em.

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 4/15/2010
KarlC@ (the obvious)

"marc rosen" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:0ba0c836-0b58-4481-b69f-b0aaa543b7f8@o30g2000pra.googlegroups.com...
> Hey All,
> I stopped in my local (Baltimore) Woodcraft today and
> noticed
> that all of the Festool items had their price obliterated.
> When I
> asked if this was in anticipation of the March 1 price
> increase the
> sales dude told me no, it was a Festool policy not to
> display their
> prices. He related to me that there was one Festool
> vendor that had
> its "license" to sell Festool revoked because they
> displayed prices.
> He was not sure if that was another Woodcraft or a more
> independent
> vendor.
> The new Festool catalogue is also devoid of prices.
> This makes
> sense since they won't have "out of date" catalogues when
> they raise
> prices again but if the vendors can't display prices on
> the floor it
> will require potential customers to interact with the
> store staff
> (which may or may not be a desireable task).
> I do not know if this is national policy or if it is
> just limited
> to Woodfcraft, or if it is just the Woodcrafts owned by
> the local
> franchiser, but it seems counter productive to me. It
> disrupts my
> eagerness to buy stuff if I have to ask prices each time I
> contemplate
> buying something. I really doubt this is a nationwwide
> policy but
> maybe it is Festool's version of buying a yacht; If you
> have to ask
> how much it is, you really can't afford it.
> On a slightly different note I'm not that excited about
> the Rotex
> 90. Unless you really need a small diameter sander the
> larger
> Festools appear to have better balance. I have a Rotex
> 150 and it is
> very easy to keep the pad flat when only holding the
> barrel . The 90
> feels barrel heavy and I think you'd need to hold down on
> the head as
> well as the barrel. Still, maybe some day I will "need"
> that 3+ inch
> diameter pad for sanding something.
> If you are a Festool junkie I think you'll also be
> happy seeing
> the new catalogue. There are a couple new battery jigsaws
> and some
> new battery drills including an 18 volt. That's got to be
> an
> expensive drill based on their other models.
> Not much else to dwell on so I'll head back down to my
> shop.
> Hope you all have a productive - and safe - weekend in
> your shop too.
> Marc
>

If this is a Festool policy, then someone report Rockler.
Either haven't got the flyer or there was no flyer.
My take is the retailer feels that if the customer sees the
tool and the price simultaneously, they will be inclined to
walk the other way rather than inquire about the features
which may otherwise incline them to consider a purchase
in spite of the dollar tag. IOW, Woodcraft wants to justify
a purchase with the sizzling spiel before revealing a cost
figure.

Whether they have actually run a test of both approaches
which decided them on this one as a better contributor to
their bottom line...who knows? But if Rockler's
current handling of the same product line means Woodcraft
is lying...then the thought of where else the profit motive
will have them decieving their clientel is something I'd
consider before stepping in the store at all.

Regards,

Edward Hennessey
Edward Hennessey

"Swingman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On 2/27/2011 3:04 PM, Leon wrote:
>> "Robatoy"<[email protected]> wrote in message
>> news:[email protected]...
>> On Feb 27, 9:54 am, "Leon"<[email protected]>
>> wrote:
>>> "TimDrouillard"<[email protected]> wrote in
>>> message
>>>
>>> news:[email protected]...
>>>
>>>> No I have not actually used one yet. All the reviews
>>>> I've read rate it
>>>> quite highly. I don't recall any of the reviewers
>>>> mentioning anything
>>>> about having a problem with seeing the cut line nor the
>>>> blade, but I'll
>>>> be
>>>> on the lookout for it now.
>>>> The biggest complaint I've heard it with regards to the
>>>> price.
>>>
>>>> Thanks.
>>>
>>> Give us a review! ;~)
>>
>> I can add one thing... there are times when either
>> configuration works
>> a little better, but if I were to have only ONE... it'd
>> be a barrel
>> grip.
>> The barrel will rotate in your hand, 360°, in effect, it
>> adds another
>> axis.
>>
>> A while ago, I was cutting out a sink hole for a drop-in
>> sink. The
>> back side of the cut was under the windowsill and my
>> top-handle
>> Milwaukee wouldn't go under the sill for me to complete
>> the cut. My
>> Bosch 'just' made it under the sill. Caveat: One must
>> remember that
>> cutting in a direction that puts the side-mounted switch
>> (on the
>> Bosch) between the barrel and the wall makes shutting the
>> saw off
>> impossible.
>>
>> My preference is the top handle but mostly because when I
>> was kid and was
>> using my dad's barrel grip, the one with a metal
>> exterior, the body got
>> quite hot.
>
> I just walked out of the shop an hour or so ago after
> using my Bosch top handle and wishing the whole time I'd
> had the barrel grip.
)

KC:

When recently reviewing comments on the Bosch barrel grip, a
hot hand after
some use was the top complaint.

What quantifies as "some use" and how sensitive some people
are to heat are
impossible to determine from the reading.

Regards,

Edward Hennessey

"Robatoy" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
On Feb 27, 9:54 am, "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote:
> "TimDrouillard" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>
> news:[email protected]...
>
> > No I have not actually used one yet. All the reviews I've read rate it
> > quite highly. I don't recall any of the reviewers mentioning anything
> > about having a problem with seeing the cut line nor the blade, but I'll
> > be
> > on the lookout for it now.
> > The biggest complaint I've heard it with regards to the price.
>
> > Thanks.
>
> Give us a review! ;~)

I can add one thing... there are times when either configuration works
a little better, but if I were to have only ONE... it'd be a barrel
grip.
The barrel will rotate in your hand, 360°, in effect, it adds another
axis.

A while ago, I was cutting out a sink hole for a drop-in sink. The
back side of the cut was under the windowsill and my top-handle
Milwaukee wouldn't go under the sill for me to complete the cut. My
Bosch 'just' made it under the sill. Caveat: One must remember that
cutting in a direction that puts the side-mounted switch (on the
Bosch) between the barrel and the wall makes shutting the saw off
impossible.

My preference is the top handle but mostly because when I was kid and was
using my dad's barrel grip, the one with a metal exterior, the body got
quite hot.

-MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote in news:[email protected]
september.org:

> I walk out of stores that don't display prices.
> Whether it's wood, tools, or beer... I will not buy from a place that
> doesn't have prices near or on the merch.

In some states, it's illegal not to post prices at least next to an item.
It used to be everything had to have the price clearly marked on the item,
but inflation made that problematic for some places. As long as you turn
over your mechandise faster than the prices go up, it's not such a big
deal.

Unless I REALLY need a specific item, I generally avoid stuff that isn't
priced. I also try to arrive at a store with a good idea of what the going
rate is. I'm certainly not going to buy an expensive power tool without
shopping around first, even if I decide to pick it up at a local store.

Doug White

"Leon" <[email protected]> wrote:

>
>"marc rosen" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:0ba0c836-0b58-4481-b69f-b0aaa543b7f8@o30g2000pra.googlegroups.com...
>> Hey All,
>> I stopped in my local (Baltimore) Woodcraft today and noticed
>> that all of the Festool items had their price obliterated. When I
>> asked if this was in anticipation of the March 1 price increase the
>> sales dude told me no, it was a Festool policy not to display their
>> prices. He related to me that there was one Festool vendor that had
>> its "license" to sell Festool revoked because they displayed prices.
>> He was not sure if that was another Woodcraft or a more independent
>> vendor.
>snip
>
>
>
>For what it is worth, Festool has all their tool prices posted on their web
>site. My local Woodcraft has their prices posted also.
>

Also McFeely's:
http://www.mcfeelys.com/info/festool-alert3.htm

On Feb 26, 1:44=A0am, -MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote:
> On 2/26/11 12:07 AM, Bill wrote:
>
> > -MIKE- wrote:
> >> I walk out of stores that don't display prices.
> >> Whether it's wood, tools, or beer... I will not buy from a place that
> >> doesn't have prices near or on the merch.
>
> > Yeah, most the used car dealers are like that around here. I feel the
> > same way you do. One family of dealers won't even give you a price unti=
l
> > they get your whole family medical history (slight exaggeration).
>
> > Bill
>
> I walked out on a car deal once, because after I had asked the guy for
> the total amount it would cost so I could call my bank and ask about
> payments, I came back and it was like $150 higher for administrative fees=
.
>
> I told him, "First of all, that's called overhead and it comes out of
> your profit. Secondly, you had your chance to disclose that when I asked
> the first time. You now have the chance to remove it or loss the sale."
>
> --
>
> =A0 -MIKE-
>
> =A0 "Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
> =A0 =A0 =A0--Elvin Jones =A0(1927-2004)
> =A0 --
> =A0http://mikedrums.com
> =A0 [email protected]
> =A0 ---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

I found at a Subaru dealer a really cool , black, 2008 WRX sti, second
stage COBB, 70,000 km.
I asked the price, which was well within my magic number, but I had to
ask if he could a little better than that, cash deal and all that.
He said he'd "waive the $450.00 admin fee." I asked him if that was
already in the original number he had given me.
He said no.
I asked him if he could really sweeten the deal by taking off a
$1000.00 admin fee that way...He didn't get my humour. I said bye.

Like those clowns who will try to get your business by offering 2
years no interest but want a 10% admin/registration fee.

No I have not actually used one yet. All the reviews I've read rate it quite
highly. I don't recall any of the reviewers mentioning anything about having
a problem with seeing the cut line nor the blade, but I'll be on the lookout
for it now.
The biggest complaint I've heard it with regards to the price.

Thanks.

"Leon" wrote in message
news:[email protected]...


"TimDrouillard" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>I thought about going with the barrel grip version, and maybe if they have
>both when I go back I'll take a look at the barrel version, but for some
>reason I'm inclined to stay with the D-handle type because that's what I've
>had for many years..
>
> I'm just a amateur woodworker. I've had a d-handle Bosch for a number of
> years that I like except for the blade holding mechanism. It's the style
> that you turn the top handle to change the blade.
>
>
> "Robatoy" wrote in message
> news:26d81528-d005-415c-b21e-e007fbc7df69@z27g2000prz.googlegroups.com...
>
> On Feb 26, 4:27 pm, "TimDrouillard" <[email protected]> wrote:
>> No, that's the PS 300 barrel grip jigsaw, I'm after the PSB 300 D-handle
>> version.
>>
> I'm a barrel-grip guy. I find I'm more accurate with it and it works
> better for me in awkward (upside-down) situations.
> I do have both. A german made Milwaukee and a Bosch barrel grip.
> Neither has any serious dust collection.

Have you used the Festool jig saw? I have no doubt that it is an excellent
tool however I was talking to a wood worker that apparently had all the
Festool stuff and he was a bit miffed with the jig saw. Apparently it is a
bit difficult to see your cut line and the blade. Something to consider.

On Feb 27, 4:57=A0pm, "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote:
> "Edward Hennessey" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>
> news:[email protected]...
>
>
>
> > When recently reviewing comments on the Bosch barrel grip, a hot hand
> > after
> > some use was the top complaint.
>
> Wow I would have thought that =A0would have been solved years ago with th=
e
> plastic bodies.

I have yet to find it too hot to handle. It gets warm...

On Sat, 26 Feb 2011 16:00:37 -0500, "TimDrouillard"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>FWIW, When I stopped by my local Woodcraft yesterday to purchase a Rotex 125
>they gave me both a general Festool catalog, as well as the latest (2011)
>Master Price list.

Highland Woodworking in Atlanta has the master price list sitting out by the
tools. The Woodcraft there, and IIRC the one in Birmingham, have prices
marked on stickers on the packaging (systainers, in the case of power tools).

In article
<0ba0c836-0b58-4481-b69f-b0aaa543b7f8@o30g2000pra.googlegroups.com>,
marc rosen <[email protected]> wrote:

> Hey All,
> I stopped in my local (Baltimore) Woodcraft today and noticed
> that all of the Festool items had their price obliterated. When I
> asked if this was in anticipation of the March 1 price increase the
> sales dude told me no, it was a Festool policy not to display their
> prices. He related to me that there was one Festool vendor that had
> its "license" to sell Festool revoked because they displayed prices.
> He was not sure if that was another Woodcraft or a more independent
> vendor.
> The new Festool catalogue is also devoid of prices. This makes
> sense since they won't have "out of date" catalogues when they raise
> prices again but if the vendors can't display prices on the floor it
> will require potential customers to interact with the store staff
> (which may or may not be a desireable task).
> I do not know if this is national policy or if it is just limited
> to Woodfcraft, or if it is just the Woodcrafts owned by the local
> franchiser, but it seems counter productive to me. It disrupts my
> eagerness to buy stuff if I have to ask prices each time I contemplate
> buying something. I really doubt this is a nationwwide policy but
> maybe it is Festool's version of buying a yacht; If you have to ask
> how much it is, you really can't afford it.
> On a slightly different note I'm not that excited about the Rotex
> 90. Unless you really need a small diameter sander the larger
> Festools appear to have better balance. I have a Rotex 150 and it is
> very easy to keep the pad flat when only holding the barrel . The 90
> feels barrel heavy and I think you'd need to hold down on the head as
> well as the barrel. Still, maybe some day I will "need" that 3+ inch
> diameter pad for sanding something.
> If you are a Festool junkie I think you'll also be happy seeing
> the new catalogue. There are a couple new battery jigsaws and some
> new battery drills including an 18 volt. That's got to be an
> expensive drill based on their other models.
> Not much else to dwell on so I'll head back down to my shop.
> Hope you all have a productive - and safe - weekend in your shop too.
> Marc

In some states the store is violating the law, since they have to
display the price or put the item price on every box. I don't know about
Maryland, but you may be able to get some money, since turning in a
store that does not follow the pricing policy has a bounty in some
states.

On Feb 27, 9:54=A0am, "Leon" <[email protected]> wrote:
> "TimDrouillard" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>
> news:[email protected]...
>
> > No I have not actually used one yet. All the reviews I've read rate it
> > quite highly. I don't recall any of the reviewers mentioning anything
> > about having a problem with seeing the cut line nor the blade, but I'll=
be
> > on the lookout for it now.
> > The biggest complaint I've heard it with regards to the price.
>
> > Thanks.
>
> Give us a review! =A0;~)

I can add one thing... there are times when either configuration works
a little better, but if I were to have only ONE... it'd be a barrel
grip.
The barrel will rotate in your hand, 360=B0, in effect, it adds another
axis.

A while ago, I was cutting out a sink hole for a drop-in sink. The
back side of the cut was under the windowsill and my top-handle
Milwaukee wouldn't go under the sill for me to complete the cut. My
Bosch 'just' made it under the sill. Caveat: One must remember that
cutting in a direction that puts the side-mounted switch (on the
Bosch) between the barrel and the wall makes shutting the saw off
impossible.

On Fri, 25 Feb 2011 17:44:50 -0800 (PST), marc rosen
<[email protected]> wrote:

>Hey All,
> I stopped in my local (Baltimore) Woodcraft today and noticed
>that all of the Festool items had their price obliterated. When I
>asked if this was in anticipation of the March 1 price increase the
>sales dude told me no, it was a Festool policy not to display their
>prices. He related to me that there was one Festool vendor that had
>its "license" to sell Festool revoked because they displayed prices.
>He was not sure if that was another Woodcraft or a more independent
>vendor.

The truth is probably that they were spending far too much time
cleaning poo off the floor in front of the green tool pricetags.
I know I just about shit every time I read one of their prices.

--
You can't wait for inspiration. You have to go after it with a club.
--Jack London

I walk out of stores that don't display prices.
Whether it's wood, tools, or beer... I will not buy from a place that
doesn't have prices near or on the merch.


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

-MIKE- wrote:
> I walk out of stores that don't display prices.
> Whether it's wood, tools, or beer... I will not buy from a place that
> doesn't have prices near or on the merch.
>

Yeah, most the used car dealers are like that around here. I feel the
same way you do. One family of dealers won't even give you a price until
they get your whole family medical history (slight exaggeration).

Bill

Edward Hennessey wrote:
> "marc rosen"<[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:0ba0c836-0b58-4481-b69f-b0aaa543b7f8@o30g2000pra.googlegroups.com...
>> Hey All,
>> I stopped in my local (Baltimore) Woodcraft today and
>> noticed
>> that all of the Festool items had their price obliterated.
>> When I
>> asked if this was in anticipation of the March 1 price
>> increase the
>> sales dude told me no, it was a Festool policy not to
>> display their
>> prices. He related to me that there was one Festool
>> vendor that had
>> its "license" to sell Festool revoked because they
>> displayed prices.
>> He was not sure if that was another Woodcraft or a more
>> independent
>> vendor.
>> The new Festool catalogue is also devoid of prices.
>> This makes
>> sense since they won't have "out of date" catalogues when
>> they raise
>> prices again but if the vendors can't display prices on
>> the floor it
>> will require potential customers to interact with the
>> store staff
>> (which may or may not be a desireable task).
>> I do not know if this is national policy or if it is
>> just limited
>> to Woodfcraft, or if it is just the Woodcrafts owned by
>> the local
>> franchiser, but it seems counter productive to me. It
>> disrupts my
>> eagerness to buy stuff if I have to ask prices each time I
>> contemplate
>> buying something. I really doubt this is a nationwwide
>> policy but
>> maybe it is Festool's version of buying a yacht; If you
>> have to ask
>> how much it is, you really can't afford it.
>> On a slightly different note I'm not that excited about
>> the Rotex
>> 90. Unless you really need a small diameter sander the
>> larger
>> Festools appear to have better balance. I have a Rotex
>> 150 and it is
>> very easy to keep the pad flat when only holding the
>> barrel . The 90
>> feels barrel heavy and I think you'd need to hold down on
>> the head as
>> well as the barrel. Still, maybe some day I will "need"
>> that 3+ inch
>> diameter pad for sanding something.
>> If you are a Festool junkie I think you'll also be
>> happy seeing
>> the new catalogue. There are a couple new battery jigsaws
>> and some
>> new battery drills including an 18 volt. That's got to be
>> an
>> expensive drill based on their other models.
>> Not much else to dwell on so I'll head back down to my
>> shop.
>> Hope you all have a productive - and safe - weekend in
>> your shop too.
>> Marc
>>
>
> If this is a Festool policy, then someone report Rockler.
> Either haven't got the flyer or there was no flyer.
> My take is the retailer feels that if the customer sees the
> tool and the price simultaneously, they will be inclined to
> walk the other way rather than inquire about the features
> which may otherwise incline them to consider a purchase
> in spite of the dollar tag. IOW, Woodcraft wants to justify
> a purchase with the sizzling spiel before revealing a cost
> figure.
>
> Whether they have actually run a test of both approaches
> which decided them on this one as a better contributor to
> their bottom line...who knows? But if Rockler's
> current handling of the same product line means Woodcraft
> is lying...then the thought of where else the profit motive
> will have them decieving their clientel is something I'd
> consider before stepping in the store at all.
>
> Regards,
>
> Edward Hennessey
> Edward Hennessey
>

I have a Rockler and Woodcraft within driving distance. I think
Rockler's prices are often about 25% more than Woodcraft's--which helps
them complensate for all of those 20%-off coupons they send out every
week. I'd rather they not sent the coupons, and just adjusted their
pricing. Like some other posters here, I'm getting impatient with
pricing "games".

Bill in IN.

On 2/26/11 12:07 AM, Bill wrote:
> -MIKE- wrote:
>> I walk out of stores that don't display prices.
>> Whether it's wood, tools, or beer... I will not buy from a place that
>> doesn't have prices near or on the merch.
>>
>
> Yeah, most the used car dealers are like that around here. I feel the
> same way you do. One family of dealers won't even give you a price until
> they get your whole family medical history (slight exaggeration).
>
> Bill

I walked out on a car deal once, because after I had asked the guy for
the total amount it would cost so I could call my bank and ask about
payments, I came back and it was like $150 higher for administrative fees.

I told him, "First of all, that's called overhead and it comes out of
your profit. Secondly, you had your chance to disclose that when I asked
the first time. You now have the chance to remove it or loss the sale."


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

-MIKE- wrote:
> On 2/26/11 12:07 AM, Bill wrote:
>> -MIKE- wrote:
>>> I walk out of stores that don't display prices.
>>> Whether it's wood, tools, or beer... I will not buy from a place that
>>> doesn't have prices near or on the merch.
>>>
>>
>> Yeah, most the used car dealers are like that around here. I feel the
>> same way you do. One family of dealers won't even give you a price until
>> they get your whole family medical history (slight exaggeration).
>>
>> Bill
>
> I walked out on a car deal once, because after I had asked the guy for
> the total amount it would cost so I could call my bank and ask about
> payments, I came back and it was like $150 higher for administrative fees.
>
> I told him, "First of all, that's called overhead and it comes out of
> your profit. Secondly, you had your chance to disclose that when I asked
> the first time. You now have the chance to remove it or loss the sale."
>

Gosh maybe we're neighbors. I ran into that same $150 administrative fee
twice (on my car and my wife's). I asked them point blank, "Are you
trying to charge me for cashing my check?" Fee was waved both times. In
the more interesting of the two cases, I was asked, "Do you want to
speak to the manager about it?", I hesitated for a moment and then said
yes, and she said, "Oh, he's out to lunch" and printed out a new bill of
sale without batting an eye. Must be good commissions in that work...

Bill

It's been a while since I was in WoodCraft, but I do remember thinking
that they should have been ashamed of the prices that they DID display.


--
When the game is over, the pawn and the king are returned to the same box.

Larry Wasserman - Baltimore Maryland - lwasserm(a)sdf. lonestar.org

On 2/26/11 8:38 AM, Doug White wrote:
> -MIKE-<[email protected]> wrote in news:[email protected]
> september.org:
>
>> I walk out of stores that don't display prices.
>> Whether it's wood, tools, or beer... I will not buy from a place that
>> doesn't have prices near or on the merch.
>
> In some states, it's illegal not to post prices at least next to an item.
> It used to be everything had to have the price clearly marked on the item,
> but inflation made that problematic for some places. As long as you turn
> over your mechandise faster than the prices go up, it's not such a big
> deal.
>

As long as there's a tag on the shelf, I don't see why every item needs
marked. I know there are still states with that antiquated law, but bar
codes kind of did away with that need.


> Unless I REALLY need a specific item, I generally avoid stuff that isn't
> priced. I also try to arrive at a store with a good idea of what the going
> rate is.

How many times do we go to a store knowing exactly what we need and how
many times do we go in thinking, "there are several ways I can do what I
need to do, let me find the cheapest?" If I have to take a salesman (or
catalog) around the store with me, I'm outta there.


> I'm certainly not going to buy an expensive power tool without
> shopping around first, even if I decide to pick it up at a local store.
>
> Doug White

My smart-phone has revolutionized my shopping experience. I just scan
the barcode and it googles the product to show me all the prices on the
internet and other local stores.


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

[email protected] wrote:
> On Sat, 26 Feb 2011 02:55:05 -0500, Bill<[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> -MIKE- wrote:
>>> On 2/26/11 12:07 AM, Bill wrote:
>>>> -MIKE- wrote:
>>>>> I walk out of stores that don't display prices.
>>>>> Whether it's wood, tools, or beer... I will not buy from a place that
>>>>> doesn't have prices near or on the merch.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Yeah, most the used car dealers are like that around here. I feel the
>>>> same way you do. One family of dealers won't even give you a price until
>>>> they get your whole family medical history (slight exaggeration).
>>>>
>>>> Bill
>>>
>>> I walked out on a car deal once, because after I had asked the guy for
>>> the total amount it would cost so I could call my bank and ask about
>>> payments, I came back and it was like $150 higher for administrative fees.
>>>
>>> I told him, "First of all, that's called overhead and it comes out of
>>> your profit. Secondly, you had your chance to disclose that when I asked
>>> the first time. You now have the chance to remove it or loss the sale."
>>>
>>
>> Gosh maybe we're neighbors. I ran into that same $150 administrative fee
>> twice (on my car and my wife's). I asked them point blank, "Are you
>> trying to charge me for cashing my check?" Fee was waved both times. In
>> the more interesting of the two cases, I was asked, "Do you want to
>> speak to the manager about it?", I hesitated for a moment and then said
>> yes, and she said, "Oh, he's out to lunch" and printed out a new bill of
>> sale without batting an eye. Must be good commissions in that work...
>
> When I lived in VT, I was very good friends with a GM of a Ford dealership.
> When I questioned their "documentation fee" he said it was a requirement of
> the state DMV that it must be the same for every sale. They can do whatever
> they want with the selling price (e.g. subtract the doc fee) but the doc fee
> *had* to be the same for all.

My transactions were in IN. I'll look at my paperwork later..it should
be easy to find...lol.

Bill

On 2/26/11 12:27 PM, [email protected] wrote:
>
> When I lived in VT, I was very good friends with a GM of a Ford dealership.
> When I questioned their "documentation fee" he said it was a requirement of
> the state DMV that it must be the same for every sale. They can do whatever
> they want with the selling price (e.g. subtract the doc fee) but the doc fee
> *had* to be the same for all.

He was at best misleading you, at worse flat out lying, which he may
have just been indoctrinated into from working there so long.

Most likely, the DMV had requirements regarding the tax & title fees. It
costs $X for a car title, which the state DMV charges, not the dealer.
The dealer is simply doing this for you as a service, probably because
it makes things easier on their end. So the DMV doesn't want them
charging $30 for a title that the consumer can go down to the DMV and
get for $10. In other words, the state outlaws the dealer double-dipping
or profiting on a state tax.

Titles fees are completely separate from the "doc fees" or "admin fees"
that dealers trump up to pad their profit. If the DMV (state law)
actually requires dealers to charge the same amount for "admin fees" to
every customer, then the dealer has the choice to charge every customer
$0 for admin fees.


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

Bill wrote:
> [email protected] wrote:
>> On Sat, 26 Feb 2011 02:55:05 -0500, Bill<[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>> -MIKE- wrote:
>>>> On 2/26/11 12:07 AM, Bill wrote:
>>>>> -MIKE- wrote:
>>>>>> I walk out of stores that don't display prices.
>>>>>> Whether it's wood, tools, or beer... I will not buy from a place that
>>>>>> doesn't have prices near or on the merch.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Yeah, most the used car dealers are like that around here. I feel the
>>>>> same way you do. One family of dealers won't even give you a price
>>>>> until
>>>>> they get your whole family medical history (slight exaggeration).
>>>>>
>>>>> Bill
>>>>
>>>> I walked out on a car deal once, because after I had asked the guy for
>>>> the total amount it would cost so I could call my bank and ask about
>>>> payments, I came back and it was like $150 higher for administrative
>>>> fees.
>>>>
>>>> I told him, "First of all, that's called overhead and it comes out of
>>>> your profit. Secondly, you had your chance to disclose that when I
>>>> asked
>>>> the first time. You now have the chance to remove it or loss the sale."
>>>>
>>>
>>> Gosh maybe we're neighbors. I ran into that same $150 administrative fee
>>> twice (on my car and my wife's). I asked them point blank, "Are you
>>> trying to charge me for cashing my check?" Fee was waved both times. In
>>> the more interesting of the two cases, I was asked, "Do you want to
>>> speak to the manager about it?", I hesitated for a moment and then said
>>> yes, and she said, "Oh, he's out to lunch" and printed out a new bill of
>>> sale without batting an eye. Must be good commissions in that work...
>>
>> When I lived in VT, I was very good friends with a GM of a Ford
>> dealership.
>> When I questioned their "documentation fee" he said it was a
>> requirement of
>> the state DMV that it must be the same for every sale. They can do
>> whatever
>> they want with the selling price (e.g. subtract the doc fee) but the
>> doc fee
>> *had* to be the same for all.
>
> My transactions were in IN. I'll look at my paperwork later..it should
> be easy to find...lol.
>
> Bill

In my case the "DOC/CRA Fee" --whatever that is, was changed from $150
to N/A. Just for the asking...

Bill

On 2/26/11 4:18 PM, [email protected] wrote:
> On Sat, 26 Feb 2011 12:49:17 -0600, -MIKE-<[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> On 2/26/11 12:27 PM, [email protected] wrote:
>>>
>>> When I lived in VT, I was very good friends with a GM of a Ford dealership.
>>> When I questioned their "documentation fee" he said it was a requirement of
>>> the state DMV that it must be the same for every sale. They can do whatever
>>> they want with the selling price (e.g. subtract the doc fee) but the doc fee
>>> *had* to be the same for all.
>>
>> He was at best misleading you, at worse flat out lying, which he may
>> have just been indoctrinated into from working there so long.
>
> Nope.
>
>> Most likely, the DMV had requirements regarding the tax& title fees. It
>> costs $X for a car title, which the state DMV charges, not the dealer.
>> The dealer is simply doing this for you as a service, probably because
>> it makes things easier on their end. So the DMV doesn't want them
>> charging $30 for a title that the consumer can go down to the DMV and
>> get for $10. In other words, the state outlaws the dealer double-dipping
>> or profiting on a state tax.
>
> Nothing to do with what the DMV charges.
>
>> Titles fees are completely separate from the "doc fees" or "admin fees"
>> that dealers trump up to pad their profit. If the DMV (state law)
>> actually requires dealers to charge the same amount for "admin fees" to
>> every customer, then the dealer has the choice to charge every customer
>> $0 for admin fees.
>
> They could, yes. They'd rather charge it, though. In VT they cannot add it
> indiscriminately. In for an ounce...
>

That's really my only point. They are blaming it on the DMV, which is BS
in so many ways, but not really the point of this discussion. The point
is, they are trying to BS the buyer into thinking they have no choice
but to charge the doc fee.


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
[email protected]
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

On 2/26/2011 4:18 PM, [email protected] wrote:
...

> They could, yes. They'd rather charge it, though. In VT they cannot add it
> indiscriminately. In for an ounce...

I'd be _very_ surprised if the law actually refers to a dealer's "admin"
fees outside of state-imposed fees as well.

As always, a reference to the applicable State Code section would clear
up the confusion... :)

--

Steve wrote:
> On 2011-02-26 01:13:49 -0500, Bill <[email protected]> said:
>
>> I have a Rockler and Woodcraft within driving distance. I think
>> Rockler's prices are often about 25% more than Woodcraft's--which
>> helps them complensate for all of those 20%-off coupons they send out
>> every week. I'd rather they not sent the coupons, and just adjusted
>> their pricing. Like some other posters here, I'm getting impatient
>> with pricing "games".
>>
>> Bill in IN.
>
> Odd -- we're talking about the same stores, but my perception is the
> reverse. Starting buying primarily at Woodcraft, now generally shop
> Rockler.

Well, take a Shelfield marking gauge for instance. One us about $30 at
Woodcraft and IIRC the same one is $43 at Rockler. Of course, each
store has stock the other lacks.

>
> Woodcraft does have better depth in turning chisels (i.e., more than
> just Sorby), including a decent house brand.
>

On 2/27/2011 3:54 PM, Leon wrote:
> "Swingman"<[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> On 2/27/2011 3:04 PM, Leon wrote:
>>
>> I just walked out of the shop an hour or so ago after using my Bosch top
>> handle and wishing the whole time I'd had the barrel grip.
>
>
> Shold'a picked up one of those too. ;~)

Damn ... I thought Festool was pricey.

Don't let C-less see the price of Makita 1/4" 18v impact drivers these days.

Shheeeeh ... another fifty and I coulda bought another Festool something
or other. ;~)

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 4/15/2010
KarlC@ (the obvious)

On Sat, 26 Feb 2011 12:49:17 -0600, -MIKE- <[email protected]> wrote:

>On 2/26/11 12:27 PM, [email protected] wrote:
>>
>> When I lived in VT, I was very good friends with a GM of a Ford dealership.
>> When I questioned their "documentation fee" he said it was a requirement of
>> the state DMV that it must be the same for every sale. They can do whatever
>> they want with the selling price (e.g. subtract the doc fee) but the doc fee
>> *had* to be the same for all.
>
>He was at best misleading you, at worse flat out lying, which he may
>have just been indoctrinated into from working there so long.

Nope.

>Most likely, the DMV had requirements regarding the tax & title fees. It
>costs $X for a car title, which the state DMV charges, not the dealer.
>The dealer is simply doing this for you as a service, probably because
>it makes things easier on their end. So the DMV doesn't want them
>charging $30 for a title that the consumer can go down to the DMV and
>get for $10. In other words, the state outlaws the dealer double-dipping
>or profiting on a state tax.

Nothing to do with what the DMV charges.

>Titles fees are completely separate from the "doc fees" or "admin fees"
>that dealers trump up to pad their profit. If the DMV (state law)
>actually requires dealers to charge the same amount for "admin fees" to
>every customer, then the dealer has the choice to charge every customer
>$0 for admin fees.

They could, yes. They'd rather charge it, though. In VT they cannot add it
indiscriminately. In for an ounce...

"TimDrouillard" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>I thought about going with the barrel grip version, and maybe if they have
>both when I go back I'll take a look at the barrel version, but for some
>reason I'm inclined to stay with the D-handle type because that's what I've
>had for many years..
>
> I'm just a amateur woodworker. I've had a d-handle Bosch for a number of
> years that I like except for the blade holding mechanism. It's the style
> that you turn the top handle to change the blade.
>
>
> "Robatoy" wrote in message
> news:26d81528-d005-415c-b21e-e007fbc7df69@z27g2000prz.googlegroups.com...
>
> On Feb 26, 4:27 pm, "TimDrouillard" <[email protected]> wrote:
>> No, that's the PS 300 barrel grip jigsaw, I'm after the PSB 300 D-handle
>> version.
>>
> I'm a barrel-grip guy. I find I'm more accurate with it and it works
> better for me in awkward (upside-down) situations.
> I do have both. A german made Milwaukee and a Bosch barrel grip.
> Neither has any serious dust collection.

Have you used the Festool jig saw? I have no doubt that it is an excellent
tool however I was talking to a wood worker that apparently had all the
Festool stuff and he was a bit miffed with the jig saw. Apparently it is a
bit difficult to see your cut line and the blade. Something to consider.

I thought about going with the barrel grip version, and maybe if they have
both when I go back I'll take a look at the barrel version, but for some
reason I'm inclined to stay with the D-handle type because that's what I've
had for many years..

I'm just a amateur woodworker. I've had a d-handle Bosch for a number of
years that I like except for the blade holding mechanism. It's the style
that you turn the top handle to change the blade.


"Robatoy" wrote in message
news:26d81528-d005-415c-b21e-e007fbc7df69@z27g2000prz.googlegroups.com...

On Feb 26, 4:27 pm, "TimDrouillard" <[email protected]> wrote:
> No, that's the PS 300 barrel grip jigsaw, I'm after the PSB 300 D-handle
> version.
>
I'm a barrel-grip guy. I find I'm more accurate with it and it works
better for me in awkward (upside-down) situations.
I do have both. A german made Milwaukee and a Bosch barrel grip.
Neither has any serious dust collection.

"marc rosen" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:0ba0c836-0b58-4481-b69f-b0aaa543b7f8@o30g2000pra.googlegroups.com...
> Hey All,
> I stopped in my local (Baltimore) Woodcraft today and noticed
> that all of the Festool items had their price obliterated. When I
> asked if this was in anticipation of the March 1 price increase the
> sales dude told me no, it was a Festool policy not to display their
> prices. He related to me that there was one Festool vendor that had
> its "license" to sell Festool revoked because they displayed prices.
> He was not sure if that was another Woodcraft or a more independent
> vendor.
snip



For what it is worth, Festool has all their tool prices posted on their web
site. My local Woodcraft has their prices posted also.