Polyurethane on Acrylic Paint

<[email protected]> wrote ...
> Hi,
>
> I recently painted a design in acrylic paint on a piece of maple wood
> that will eventually be subject to elements such as UV, weather, foot
> traffic, etc. I've heard that marine polyurethane is the way to go to
> protect this sort of project, but I'm having a heard time finding one
> that is water-based and would not smear my acrylic paint.
> Is any water-based polyurethane (I've found some with UV protectant)
> going to do the job?
>
> Also, what are the benefits/features/differences of matte, satin, and
> gloss?
>
> I've found quite a few water-based polyurethanes at this site:
>
> http://paint-and-supplies.hardwarestore.com/60-352-clear-finish-polyu...
>
> Any other suggestions for this project are greatly appreciated.
> This is what I've painted for those interested (it is the platform on
> the top of the trailer).
> <img src="http://www.surlybikes.com/blogimages/stoked_dummy_lg.jpg">
>
> Cheers,
> A

This is a common problem when applying finishes over stains too.
The solution there has been to apply a coat of shellac first to seal
the stain, then apply the poly, varnish, whatever.
Art

Tue, Jan 29, 2008, 3:35pm (EST-3) [email protected] mumbled:
Hi,
I recently painted a design in acrylic paint on a piece of maple wood
that will eventually be subject to elements such as UV, weather, foot
traffic, etc. I've heard that marine polyurethane is the way to go to
protect this sort of project, <snip>

You guys never cease to amaze you. I'm gonna call all the 1-800
numbers on the cans and tel them to stop putting it on the labels,
because no one calls them anyway. Now me, if I had a question like
yours, I'd call the all the 1-800 numbers i could and ask them. But
that's j ust me.



JOAT
10 Out Of 10 Terrorists Prefer Hillary For President - Bumper Sticker

I don't have a problem with a woman president - except for Hillary.

On Jan 29, 6:35=A0pm, [email protected] wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I recently painted a design in acrylic paint on a piece of maple wood
> that will eventually be subject to elements such as UV, weather, foot
> traffic, etc. I've heard that marine polyurethane is the way to go to
> protect this sort of project, but I'm having a heard time finding one
> that is water-based and would not smear my acrylic paint.
> Is any water-based polyurethane (I've found some with UV protectant)
> going to do the job?
>
> Also, what are the benefits/features/differences of matte, satin, and
> gloss?
>
> I've found quite a few water-based polyurethanes at this site:
>
> http://paint-and-supplies.hardwarestore.com/60-352-clear-finish-polyu...
>
> Any other suggestions for this project are greatly appreciated.
> This is what I've painted for those interested (it is the platform on
> the top of the trailer).
> <img src=3D"http://www.surlybikes.com/blogimages/stoked_dummy_lg.jpg">
>
> Cheers,
> A

You are going to have slim pickin's for water based exterior and my
guess is you may be hard pressed to find much other than gloss. Zar
makes a water based exterior poly and I think it may be available in
gloss only but not sure. Most water based poly's just dont have the
ability to stand up to exterior use and especially UV. The finish is
less of an issue but the gloss finishes tend to be less pourous and
therefore better for exterior applications. You may find some matte
varnish at an art supply store or on the net that would handle
exterior with several coats (usually 6-10)

Mark

On Jan 29, 6:35 pm, [email protected] wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I recently painted a design in acrylic paint on a piece of maple wood
> that will eventually be subject to elements such as UV, weather, foot
> traffic, etc. I've heard that marine polyurethane is the way to go to
> protect this sort of project, but I'm having a heard time finding one
> that is water-based and would not smear my acrylic paint.

Shouldn't smear. Acrylic is no longer soluble once it's dry.
Test on a piece of scrap if in doubt.

On Jan 29, 9:01=A0pm, [email protected] (J T) wrote:
> Now me, if I had a question like
> yours, I'd call the all the 1-800 numbers i could and ask them. =A0But
> that's j ust me.
>


Many times calling the 800 number is an absolute waste of time as you
get someone who has been briefed in the HGTV aspects of the product
not the real technichal aspects. Additionally you will only get the
textbook answer and never any creative or outside the box answers. The
will also never say "well, our product will not work in that
application but her is a phone number to our competitor, they do have
a product that is just what you are looking for". I have had some
troubles with minwax polycrylic in the past in homes with forced hot
air heat and calling the 800 number was a total joke.

A far more successful tact is dealing with a reputable supplier who
deals with the nitty gritty of the product on a daily basis. They hear
daily from dozens if not hundreds of individuals and proffessionals
who work with the product. They also, through direct experience, know
what is really possible and what will and will not work with a given
product regardless of what the label or the 800 number says. A good
supplier will be more than willing to say "I dont have what you need,
but there is a place across town that does, let me give them a call
and get you in touch with them".

I can think of dozens of things we do with finishes that the MFR would
expressly tell you not to do and they work day in and day out.

Mark

[email protected] wrote:
>
>
> If I apply the Seal Coat, will the polyurethane still create a
> yellowing effect?

Yes. The yellow color is in the oil poly.

The barrier coat of dewaxed shellac (aka Seal Coat) is to prevent one
product from interfering with the other. If the sealer is going over
something that may be disturbed by alcohol, like lettering and certain
dyes and stains, it should be sprayed. Luckily, Zinsser Clear Spray
Shellac is dewaxed, cheap, and handy.

If you possess the acrylic paint and the poly, you can make a test panel
that may prove the barrier unnecessary.

I've been bitten in the ass enough times that I use a barrier any time
I'm not absolutely positively sure of the final result.

I've also learned that test samples take far less time than repairing
and redoing the actual work, so I always have time to test if I'm not
positively sure of the outcome. <G>

On Tue, 29 Jan 2008 15:35:01 -0800, funkypandamonium wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I recently painted a design in acrylic paint on a piece of maple wood
> that will eventually be subject to elements such as UV, weather, foot
> traffic, etc. I've heard that marine polyurethane is the way to go to
> protect this sort of project, but I'm having a heard time finding one
> that is water-based and would not smear my acrylic paint. Is any
> water-based polyurethane (I've found some with UV protectant) going to
> do the job?
>
> Also, what are the benefits/features/differences of matte, satin, and
> gloss?
>
> I've found quite a few water-based polyurethanes at this site:
>
> http://paint-and-supplies.hardwarestore.com/60-352-clear-finish-polyu...
>
> Any other suggestions for this project are greatly appreciated. This is
> what I've painted for those interested (it is the platform on the top of
> the trailer).
> <img src="http://www.surlybikes.com/blogimages/stoked_dummy_lg.jpg">
>
> Cheers,
> A

Several of the acrylic paint companies make varnishes for protecting
acrylic paintings. Golden is one company that comes to mind.

http://www.goldenpaints.com/

Their web-site also has a lot of information. Might be worth a look.

D. G. Adams

On Jan 30, 5:02=A0pm, B A R R Y <[email protected]> wrote:
> On Tue, 29 Jan 2008 15:35:01 -0800 (PST), [email protected]
> wrote:
>
> >Any other suggestions for this project are greatly appreciated.
> >This is what I've painted for those interested (it is the platform on
> >the top of the trailer).
> ><img src=3D"http://www.surlybikes.com/blogimages/stoked_dummy_lg.jpg">
>
> I'm guessing by trailer, you mean rear rack. =A0<G>
>
> Now that I see the project, I think I'd stick with a marine varnish,
> with the barrier I've mentioned earlier, between. =A0Marine varnish will
> stand up to the elements very well, and a little "ambering" won't hurt
> the overall look. =A0It's already got a touch of amber to it.
>
> I work in a bicycle shop, and most all of the wood parts on cruisers
> and commuters seem to be covered with a tough, exterior varnish.
>
> I see what looks to be a Cateye LED lamp on the front fender, but
> what's the box on the h-bar?
>
> How does the bike handle with such a long wheelbase? =A0Is it like
> riding a tandem with no stoker?
>
> Great looking project, though! =A0I love odd bikes!
>
> ---------------------------------------------
> **http://www.bburke.com/woodworking.html=A0**
> ---------------------------------------------

Barry,

The bike in the picture is a FreeRadical Xtracycle (check them out on
Xtracycle.com). The long wheel base allows for more stability and the
Xtracycle is much better than any rack or other bike trailer you will
come across.

This bike pictured isn't actually my bike, that is one I found online
that had the best photo showing the whole idea. However, mine is just
the same, only a different bike. What you see in that picture is the
standard finish on the 'snap deck'. I sanded down the finish and
painted a design with acrylic on that.

Thanks for the advice!

On Jan 29, 4:06 pm, BDBConstruction <[email protected]> wrote:
> On Jan 29, 6:35 pm, [email protected] wrote:
>
>
>
> > Hi,
>
> > I recently painted a design in acrylic paint on a piece of maple wood
> > that will eventually be subject to elements such as UV, weather, foot
> > traffic, etc. I've heard that marine polyurethane is the way to go to
> > protect this sort of project, but I'm having a heard time finding one
> > that is water-based and would not smear my acrylic paint.
> > Is any water-based polyurethane (I've found some with UV protectant)
> > going to do the job?
>
> > Also, what are the benefits/features/differences of matte, satin, and
> > gloss?
>
> > I've found quite a few water-based polyurethanes at this site:
>
> >http://paint-and-supplies.hardwarestore.com/60-352-clear-finish-polyu...
>
> > Any other suggestions for this project are greatly appreciated.
> > This is what I've painted for those interested (it is the platform on
> > the top of the trailer).
> > <img src="http://www.surlybikes.com/blogimages/stoked_dummy_lg.jpg">
>
> > Cheers,
> > A
>
> You are going to have slim pickin's for water based exterior and my
> guess is you may be hard pressed to find much other than gloss. Zar
> makes a water based exterior poly and I think it may be available in
> gloss only but not sure. Most water based poly's just dont have the
> ability to stand up to exterior use and especially UV. The finish is
> less of an issue but the gloss finishes tend to be less pourous and
> therefore better for exterior applications. You may find some matte
> varnish at an art supply store or on the net that would handle
> exterior with several coats (usually 6-10)
>
> Mark

Mark,

I've heard some folks say that an oil-based polyurethane won't harm
acrylic paint if as long as the paint is completely dry. But other's
have said it will smear or crack the acrylic.

Any thoughts?

On Jan 29, 5:06 pm, "Bonehenge (B A R R Y)"
<[email protected]> wrote:
> On Tue, 29 Jan 2008 16:13:55 -0800 (PST), [email protected]
> wrote:
>
> >I've heard some folks say that an oil-based polyurethane won't harm
> >acrylic paint if as long as the paint is completely dry.
>
> It shouldn't, but it will yellow it.
>
> You can almost always prevent two unknowns from interfering with a
> barrier coat of Seal Coat (brushed or sprayed) or sprayed aerosol
> Clear Shellac. Either will go under anything, and over anything.

If I apply the Seal Coat, will the polyurethane still create a
yellowing effect?

[email protected] wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I recently painted a design in acrylic paint on a piece of maple
> wood
> that will eventually be subject to elements such as UV, weather,
> foot
> traffic, etc. I've heard that marine polyurethane is the way to go
> to
> protect this sort of project, but I'm having a heard time finding
> one
> that is water-based and would not smear my acrylic paint.
> Is any water-based polyurethane (I've found some with UV protectant)
> going to do the job?
>
> Also, what are the benefits/features/differences of matte, satin,
> and
> gloss?
>
> I've found quite a few water-based polyurethanes at this site:
>
> http://paint-and-supplies.hardwarestore.com/60-352-clear-finish-polyu...
>
> Any other suggestions for this project are greatly appreciated.
> This is what I've painted for those interested (it is the platform
> on
> the top of the trailer).
> <img src="http://www.surlybikes.com/blogimages/stoked_dummy_lg.jpg">
>
> Cheers,

If that "Cheers" indicates that you're in the UK then you're in
luck--in the EU there's a product called "Sikkens Autoclear WB", a
waterborne automotive clearcoat. Good luck finding it in the US
though. duPont supposedly has a similar product.

I suspect that it's expensive and it's a multipart system, but it
should last as long as any other automotive paint.

--
--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

[email protected] wrote:
> On Jan 29, 4:06 pm, BDBConstruction <[email protected]> wrote:
>> On Jan 29, 6:35 pm, [email protected] wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>> Hi,
>>> I recently painted a design in acrylic paint on a piece of maple wood
>>> that will eventually be subject to elements such as UV, weather, foot
>>> traffic, etc. I've heard that marine polyurethane is the way to go to
>>> protect this sort of project, but I'm having a heard time finding one
>>> that is water-based and would not smear my acrylic paint.
>>> Is any water-based polyurethane (I've found some with UV protectant)
>>> going to do the job?
>>> Also, what are the benefits/features/differences of matte, satin, and
>>> gloss?
>>> I've found quite a few water-based polyurethanes at this site:
>>> http://paint-and-supplies.hardwarestore.com/60-352-clear-finish-polyu...
>>> Any other suggestions for this project are greatly appreciated.
>>> This is what I've painted for those interested (it is the platform on
>>> the top of the trailer).
>>> <img src="http://www.surlybikes.com/blogimages/stoked_dummy_lg.jpg">
>>> Cheers,
>>> A
>> You are going to have slim pickin's for water based exterior and my
>> guess is you may be hard pressed to find much other than gloss. Zar
>> makes a water based exterior poly and I think it may be available in
>> gloss only but not sure. Most water based poly's just dont have the
>> ability to stand up to exterior use and especially UV. The finish is
>> less of an issue but the gloss finishes tend to be less pourous and
>> therefore better for exterior applications. You may find some matte
>> varnish at an art supply store or on the net that would handle
>> exterior with several coats (usually 6-10)
>>
>> Mark
>
> Mark,
>
> I've heard some folks say that an oil-based polyurethane won't harm
> acrylic paint if as long as the paint is completely dry. But other's
> have said it will smear or crack the acrylic.
>
> Any thoughts?

Flexner has an article in this month's
Popular Woodworking that addresses that
very question.

"Almost any finishing product - stain,
filler, glaze, finish - can be applied
successfully over any other finishing
product, except wax, as long as the
product is dry."

Dryness seems to be the real key here,
and depending on the bottom coat, it may
be days or weeks before it's truly dry.

Popular Woodworking, Feb. 2008, p. 92

--
Tanus

This is not really a sig.

http://www.home.mycybernet.net/~waugh/shop/

On Tue, 29 Jan 2008 15:35:01 -0800 (PST), [email protected]
wrote:

>Any other suggestions for this project are greatly appreciated.
>This is what I've painted for those interested (it is the platform on
>the top of the trailer).
><img src="http://www.surlybikes.com/blogimages/stoked_dummy_lg.jpg">

I'm guessing by trailer, you mean rear rack. <G>

Now that I see the project, I think I'd stick with a marine varnish,
with the barrier I've mentioned earlier, between. Marine varnish will
stand up to the elements very well, and a little "ambering" won't hurt
the overall look. It's already got a touch of amber to it.

I work in a bicycle shop, and most all of the wood parts on cruisers
and commuters seem to be covered with a tough, exterior varnish.

I see what looks to be a Cateye LED lamp on the front fender, but
what's the box on the h-bar?

How does the bike handle with such a long wheelbase? Is it like
riding a tandem with no stoker?

Great looking project, though! I love odd bikes!


---------------------------------------------
** http://www.bburke.com/woodworking.html **
---------------------------------------------

On Tue, 29 Jan 2008 16:13:55 -0800 (PST), [email protected]
wrote:


>I've heard some folks say that an oil-based polyurethane won't harm
>acrylic paint if as long as the paint is completely dry.

It shouldn't, but it will yellow it.

You can almost always prevent two unknowns from interfering with a
barrier coat of Seal Coat (brushed or sprayed) or sprayed aerosol
Clear Shellac. Either will go under anything, and over anything.