Did you wipe?
Brian.
"Mark Brinich" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:AfqEc.36055$cj3.18831@lakeread01...
> I applied several coats of tung oil/mineral spirits to a plant stand.
> For the final coat it said to apply pure tung oil. Well I did that and
> I'm still waiting after 4 days for it to dry. Should I have done this
> and/or will it ever dry?
"Mark Brinich" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:AfqEc.36055$cj3.18831@lakeread01...
> I applied several coats of tung oil/mineral spirits to a plant stand.
> For the final coat it said to apply pure tung oil. Well I did that and
> I'm still waiting after 4 days for it to dry. Should I have done this
> and/or will it ever dry?
It will not dry. Oil finishes are not meant to build up a film. You are
supposed to apply the oil and let it penetrate the wood for maybe 10-15
minutes and then wipe off the excess.
Frank
With all those oil-based varnishes out there, I'm sure you must realize
that oil finishes do build, and do cure, but they need help. That's
provided chemically, by the addition of siccatives, or temporally.
"Pure Tung Oil" will require a lot of the latter, or it will require solvent
removal and firming up with a tung-based varnish or tung with siccatives.
"Frank Ketchum" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> "Mark Brinich" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:AfqEc.36055$cj3.18831@lakeread01...
> > I applied several coats of tung oil/mineral spirits to a plant stand.
> > For the final coat it said to apply pure tung oil. Well I did that and
> > I'm still waiting after 4 days for it to dry. Should I have done this
> > and/or will it ever dry?
>
> It will not dry. Oil finishes are not meant to build up a film. You are
> supposed to apply the oil and let it penetrate the wood for maybe 10-15
> minutes and then wipe off the excess.
>
> Frank
>
>
Must have missed this article, I guess.
http://www.popularwoodworking.com/features/finish3.html "The Issue of
Metallic Driers ff "
As stated, the _oil_ cures with help. If the wood is oiled to refusal,
there _will_ be a "surface finish" of oil, it having nowhere to go.
Resins are added to improve surface hardness, at which point they become
"varnish" regardless of the amount of solids.
http://www.taunton.com/finewoodworking/pages/w00063.asp
If the solids are things like metallic salts (pigment), you get paint.
Infomercial at http://www.sutherlandwelles.com/tungoil.htm is pretty good
on the peculiarities of tung. Folks who bought carvings in SEA during the
distant festivities there can usually see tung surface finishes on their
souvenir carvings.
"G. Lewin" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> I don't think this is the case. Oil finishes, real oil finishes like
> tung and linseed oil, will cure, but never dry hard enough to "build" a
> finish on top of the wood.
>
SNIP
This is more or less culled from "Understanding Wood Finishing" by
Flexnor. An indespensible reference, in my view, although others have
their favorites (google the wreck for wood finishing books).
> Greg
> George wrote:
> > With all those oil-based varnishes out there, I'm sure you must realize
> > that oil finishes do build, and do cure, but they need help. That's
> > provided chemically, by the addition of siccatives, or temporally.
> >
> > "Pure Tung Oil" will require a lot of the latter, or it will require
solvent
> > removal and firming up with a tung-based varnish or tung with
siccatives.
> >
Well, personal definitions are certainly important, but qualifications such
as "meaningful" can make communication difficult. Also difficult if you
don't read the message for understanding, but for rebuttal. I recommended
removal of the surface film (yep, can't remove the wood) and recoating with
oil treated with either driers or driers/varnish, as preferred.
I'm not sure what makes us think we can slap on three applications in three
days of an oil that says allow several days for the surface to cure. What
we end up with is a curing film trying to be dissolved by the uncured stuff
inside. If it takes days in open air, how much longer must it take in an
oxygen-poor environment in the pores of the wood?
Oil is what makes the film in paint, in varnish, and on its own. Various
ingredients, as I indicated, can make the film harder, color it, or
otherwise modify its curing properties. Take a peek at the cap of your
linseed, unless you're one of those fastidious types who wipes off the
excess, and there'll be a tough, flexible amber-colored film on top of the
impenetrable metal or plastic. It's wonderful stuff.
As you walk the hallowed halls of Dartmouth, remember that film - it's
linoleum.
"G. Lewin" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Well, my disagreement was not with the drying time, but the building of
> the finish. You simply can't build (where "build" is defined as to
> develop a useful film of finish exterior to the wood) a pure tung oil
> finish. OK, as Mike G notes, maybe you can get _something_, but it's
> pointless.
>
> Your apparent statement that oil-based varnishes can be built therefore
> all oil finishes can be built neglects the different chemistry of the
> varnish (which, admittedly, I seem to have butchered).
>
> As for the length of cure. Well, a week of waiting for the tung oil to
> cure on my atlas stand demonstrates the need for dryers quite well, eh?
Is this plant stand a piece furniture or something that is going to get wet
from watering the plants? If it is a piece of furniture and not something
you are going to slop water all over, I would remove the pure tung oil with
mineral spirts and let it dry. I would them apply several THIN coats (5)
of Tung Oil Varnish. This is a tung oil/varnish mixture with a dryer.
Minwax makes it and is comes in a yellow can. You can pick it up most
anywhere including Home Depot.
Make sure you wipe ALL the excess Tung Oil off after applying it. Sand
lightly between coats with 600 grit sand paper. The tung oil varnish will
dry fairly quickly depending on the humidity.
James
Makers of Small Table Making Software
http://www.knightlite.com/creative
"Mark Brinich" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:AfqEc.36055$cj3.18831@lakeread01...
> I applied several coats of tung oil/mineral spirits to a plant stand.
> For the final coat it said to apply pure tung oil. Well I did that and
> I'm still waiting after 4 days for it to dry. Should I have done this
> and/or will it ever dry?
>
The usual horse pucky.
Varnish by today's accepted definition is oil, carrier/thinner and RESINS
that cross link and give a surface build.
Oil applied in sufficient quantity to build will, as the gentleman with the
oil on the plywood found out, remain sticky for quite some time and will, as
all pure oil finish do, provide little relative protection to the project.
For those reasons, while it is possible given enough oil applied to saturate
the cells of the wood with enough cured to stop further absorption have it
sit on the surface and cure to some extent, it is not only folly to attempt
it but a monumental waste of time and materials when an actual varnish is
available and designed to be a surface finish.
--
Mike G.
Heirloom Woods
[email protected]
www.heirloom-woods.net
"George" <george@least> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> With all those oil-based varnishes out there, I'm sure you must realize
> that oil finishes do build, and do cure, but they need help. That's
> provided chemically, by the addition of siccatives, or temporally.
>
> "Pure Tung Oil" will require a lot of the latter, or it will require
solvent
> removal and firming up with a tung-based varnish or tung with siccatives.
>
> "Frank Ketchum" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> >
> > "Mark Brinich" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> > news:AfqEc.36055$cj3.18831@lakeread01...
> > > I applied several coats of tung oil/mineral spirits to a plant stand.
> > > For the final coat it said to apply pure tung oil. Well I did that
and
> > > I'm still waiting after 4 days for it to dry. Should I have done
this
> > > and/or will it ever dry?
> >
> > It will not dry. Oil finishes are not meant to build up a film. You
are
> > supposed to apply the oil and let it penetrate the wood for maybe 10-15
> > minutes and then wipe off the excess.
> >
> > Frank
> >
> >
>
>
I don't think this is the case. Oil finishes, real oil finishes like
tung and linseed oil, will cure, but never dry hard enough to "build" a
finish on top of the wood.
Oil-based varnishes are different. The oil in a varnish is chemically
modified (by heat) so that it no longer has the same structure as oil.
The amount and type of oil will affect how hard the varnish becomes upon
drying (short-oil vs. long-oil).
Oil/varnish blends (such as Danish oil, Minwax Antique Oil Finish, or
just about anything that calls itself "Tung Oil" without saying it's
_pure_ tung oil) are yet another finish, simply being a mixture of any
oil and varnish. They are not meant to be built, but I suppose if the
amount of oil were small, you might be able to.
This is more or less culled from "Understanding Wood Finishing" by
Flexnor. An indespensible reference, in my view, although others have
their favorites (google the wreck for wood finishing books).
I have been having this same problem as the original poster. I
attributed it to "low-odor" mineral spirits, which probably gets its low
odor from using longer chain, less volatile (ie, longer drying time)
compounds. After about 3 days, I put the workpiece out in the sun for an
hour and it wept like a baby. It's not too bad now, so I'm going to try
to put a spit coat of varnish on it. Could be a big mistake -- we'll see.
Greg
George wrote:
> With all those oil-based varnishes out there, I'm sure you must realize
> that oil finishes do build, and do cure, but they need help. That's
> provided chemically, by the addition of siccatives, or temporally.
>
> "Pure Tung Oil" will require a lot of the latter, or it will require solvent
> removal and firming up with a tung-based varnish or tung with siccatives.
>
> "Frank Ketchum" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>
>>"Mark Brinich" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>news:AfqEc.36055$cj3.18831@lakeread01...
>>
>>>I applied several coats of tung oil/mineral spirits to a plant stand.
>>>For the final coat it said to apply pure tung oil. Well I did that and
>>>I'm still waiting after 4 days for it to dry. Should I have done this
>>>and/or will it ever dry?
>>
>>It will not dry. Oil finishes are not meant to build up a film. You are
>>supposed to apply the oil and let it penetrate the wood for maybe 10-15
>>minutes and then wipe off the excess.
>>
>>Frank
>>
>>
>
>
>
Well, my disagreement was not with the drying time, but the building of
the finish. You simply can't build (where "build" is defined as to
develop a useful film of finish exterior to the wood) a pure tung oil
finish. OK, as Mike G notes, maybe you can get _something_, but it's
pointless.
Your apparent statement that oil-based varnishes can be built therefore
all oil finishes can be built neglects the different chemistry of the
varnish (which, admittedly, I seem to have butchered).
As for the length of cure. Well, a week of waiting for the tung oil to
cure on my atlas stand demonstrates the need for dryers quite well, eh?
Greg
George wrote:
> Must have missed this article, I guess.
>
> http://www.popularwoodworking.com/features/finish3.html "The Issue of
> Metallic Driers ff "
>
> As stated, the _oil_ cures with help. If the wood is oiled to refusal,
> there _will_ be a "surface finish" of oil, it having nowhere to go.
>
> Resins are added to improve surface hardness, at which point they become
> "varnish" regardless of the amount of solids.
> http://www.taunton.com/finewoodworking/pages/w00063.asp
>
> If the solids are things like metallic salts (pigment), you get paint.
>
> Infomercial at http://www.sutherlandwelles.com/tungoil.htm is pretty good
> on the peculiarities of tung. Folks who bought carvings in SEA during the
> distant festivities there can usually see tung surface finishes on their
> souvenir carvings.
>
> "G. Lewin" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>
>>I don't think this is the case. Oil finishes, real oil finishes like
>>tung and linseed oil, will cure, but never dry hard enough to "build" a
>>finish on top of the wood.
>>
>
> SNIP
>
> This is more or less culled from "Understanding Wood Finishing" by
> Flexnor. An indespensible reference, in my view, although others have
> their favorites (google the wreck for wood finishing books).
>
>>Greg
>
>
>>George wrote:
>>
>>>With all those oil-based varnishes out there, I'm sure you must realize
>>>that oil finishes do build, and do cure, but they need help. That's
>>>provided chemically, by the addition of siccatives, or temporally.
>>>
>>>"Pure Tung Oil" will require a lot of the latter, or it will require
>
> solvent
>
>>>removal and firming up with a tung-based varnish or tung with
>
> siccatives.
>
>
>
Pure tung oil is a hardening oil, and it *will* harden to a matte
surface, although it can take a very long time. If your drying
environment is reasonably warm (e.g., not in the basement), it may
take anywhere from 2 days to maybe a week. In my basement, which is
cool, tung stays liquid for at least 2 weeks when exposed to air.
Mark Brinich <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<AfqEc.36055$cj3.18831@lakeread01>...
> I applied several coats of tung oil/mineral spirits to a plant stand.
> For the final coat it said to apply pure tung oil. Well I did that and
> I'm still waiting after 4 days for it to dry. Should I have done this
> and/or will it ever dry?
I have run into the same problem with tung and danish oil. As the previous
posts imply, it is very important to wipe after 15-30 minutes. I have had
wet residue stay wet for days. Try setting the project in direct sunlight,
behind a south window or patio door, for a day or so. That usually works.
"Mark Brinich" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:AfqEc.36055$cj3.18831@lakeread01...
> I applied several coats of tung oil/mineral spirits to a plant stand.
> For the final coat it said to apply pure tung oil. Well I did that and
> I'm still waiting after 4 days for it to dry. Should I have done this
> and/or will it ever dry?
Did you wipe off all the excess from the surface of the wood after EVERY
coat has set for the amount of time most likely listed on the can?
Leaving a thick coat sitting on the surface of the wood is the usual reason
similar posts show up here.
--
Mike G.
Heirloom Woods
[email protected]
www.heirloom-woods.net
"Mark Brinich" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:AfqEc.36055$cj3.18831@lakeread01...
> I applied several coats of tung oil/mineral spirits to a plant stand.
> For the final coat it said to apply pure tung oil. Well I did that and
> I'm still waiting after 4 days for it to dry. Should I have done this
> and/or will it ever dry?