Hi,
I have seen some wood workers use a colourless transparant epoxy for
filling holes in wood. They said it was the same hardness as the wood
and easily sanded.
Where might I find such a product and what would it be called?
I have a very nice set of salad servers made from olive wood, and
unfortunately, one of the tines on the fork cracked and broke off, I'm
hoping to use this product to repair it. It appears as though there was
a natural fault in the wood at that spot which caused it to break. Will
i be able to use such a product to repair this permanently?
Thanks for any advice,
Jason
On 22-Jul-2004, Jason Lewis <[email protected]> wrote:
> I'll endeavour to find some epoxy like the system three at the hardware
> store here (in Australia)
You're not likely to find that kind of epoxy in a hardware store. Your
best bet is a marine supply place. One of the biggest problems with
those brands (MAS, System 3, West etc) is they don't often sell in small
quantities. It's easy to get a liter or more, but a quarter liter
is another thing. I think West Systems makes a small repair kit,
but I've never seen it in marine shops near me. Hope you're luckier.
Mike
"Jason Lewis" writes:
> Yes, I have found it hard to find.
Check in any major population center that has some marinas of other marine
activity.
Certainly no problem in Sydney.
--
Hodco Systems Inc
Box 2302
Whittier, Ca, 90610-2302
(V) 562-944-4432
(F) 562-944-0494
E-Mail: [email protected]
Lew Hodgett, PE
Thanks for all your responses.
I'll endeavour to find some epoxy like the system three at the hardware
store here (in Australia)
Jason
Jason Lewis wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I have seen some wood workers use a colourless transparant epoxy for
> filling holes in wood. They said it was the same hardness as the wood
> and easily sanded.
>
> Where might I find such a product and what would it be called?
>
> I have a very nice set of salad servers made from olive wood, and
> unfortunately, one of the tines on the fork cracked and broke off, I'm
> hoping to use this product to repair it. It appears as though there was
> a natural fault in the wood at that spot which caused it to break. Will
> i be able to use such a product to repair this permanently?
>
> Thanks for any advice,
>
> Jason
Yes, I have found it hard to find. I checked at Bunnings, and they
didn't have anything appropriate. I'm starting to think i might just use
a PVA glue of some sort.
Jason
Michael Daly wrote:
> On 22-Jul-2004, Jason Lewis <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
>>I'll endeavour to find some epoxy like the system three at the hardware
>>store here (in Australia)
>
>
> You're not likely to find that kind of epoxy in a hardware store. Your
> best bet is a marine supply place. One of the biggest problems with
> those brands (MAS, System 3, West etc) is they don't often sell in small
> quantities. It's easy to get a liter or more, but a quarter liter
> is another thing. I think West Systems makes a small repair kit,
> but I've never seen it in marine shops near me. Hope you're luckier.
>
> Mike
On 23-Jul-2004, "Lew Hodgett" <[email protected]> wrote:
> > Also---latex gloves pass some of the chemicals through to your skin.
> > Use nitrile or vinyl gloves.
>
> Actually, I use two (2) sets of gloves, a latex surgical type pair covered
> by a pair of what are known as "canner's gloves" which has a cuff just above
> the wrist.
I, too, prefer the nitrile gloves. Don't use them with MEK-based hardeners
with resins (i.e. polyester, vinylester), but they are fine with epoxies.
I wear several layers of gloves. If the outer layer becomes too messed up
to continue, I just tear off the outer glove and keep working. For
something as simple as the OP's repair, I'd wear two layers and potentially
reuse the inner ones if nothing happened to them.
Mike
On Thu, 22 Jul 2004 21:48:32 -0500, Lew Hodgett calmly ranted:
"Larry Jaques" writes:
>> Have you tried System 3 or MAS epoxies? If so, how do they compare?
>
>Have used a lot of System 3, especially when the price is right<G>..
So you prefer it over the other 2? Do you use the # of pump
strokes or go by weight when mixing?
>> Best pricing on epoxy comes from ________?
>
>Strictly a commodity item.
>From my perspective, snot is snot, it all works.
That's good to know.
>Price will be a function of quantity purchased.
So I see. =:-0
>I buy resin in 500 lb drums, so I have absolutely no feel
>for the retail market.
I wouldn't expect so, Mr. Deep Pockets. Average drum price?
---------------------------------------------------
I drive way too fast to worry about my cholesterol.
---------------------------------------------------
http://www.diversify.com Refreshing Graphic Design
On Sat, 24 Jul 2004 04:29:42 GMT, "Lew Hodgett"
<[email protected]> calmly ranted:
>
>"Larry Jaques" writes:
>
>> Curiosity has no number, sir. 1?
>
>Might some body to take an order for $3/lb, maybe a little less.
Bueno, bwana. I'll check back with you after I return
from somebody's birthday party next week.
- Ever wonder what the speed of lightning would be if it didn't zigzag? -
http://diversify.com Full Service Web Application Programming
"Larry Jaques" writes:
>Do you use the # of pump
> strokes or go by weight when mixing?
I designed and built a motorized pump metering system operated by a foot
switch.
Used two (2), 1/2" gear pumps, each connected to a jack shaft by a bicycle
chain so that they pump the exact ratio of resin to hardner.
A belt drive connects the jack shaft to the motor ansd away we go.
Typically, mix about 1-1/2 quarts of resin per batch.
> Average drum price?
How many drums do you want to buy?
--
Lew
S/A: Challenge, The Bullet Proof Boat, (Under Construction in the Southland)
Visit: <http://home.earthlink.net/~lewhodgett> for Pictures
"Larry Jaques" writes:
> Have you tried System 3 or MAS epoxies? If so, how do they compare?
Have used a lot of System 3, especially when the price is right<G>..
> Best pricing on epoxy comes from ________?
Strictly a commodity item.
From my perspective, snot is snot, it all works.
Price will be a function of quantity purchased.
I buy resin in 500 lb drums, so I have absolutely no feel for the retail
market.
HTH
--
Lew
S/A: Challenge, The Bullet Proof Boat, (Under Construction in the Southland)
Visit: <http://home.earthlink.net/~lewhodgett> for Pictures
"Lew Hodgett" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> "Jason Lewis" writes:
>
>
> > I have seen some wood workers use a colourless transparant epoxy for
> > filling holes in wood. They said it was the same hardness as the wood
> > and easily sanded.
> >
> > Where might I find such a product and what would it be called?
>
> It would be called "epoxy"<G>.
>
> Epoxy is by design, a clear liquid unless you and a pigment color to it.
>
> Don't know where you are but it appears to be outside the US.
>
> Do you have any boat builders in your area?
>
> If so, try to find the WEST system epoxy from the Gougeon Bros.
>
I have a gallon of WEST epoxy left over from a boat project, and have tried
to use it as glue. It doesn't work out very well. I recommend buying real
epoxy glue. What ever they use to thicken it works much better than the saw
dust I tried. (Laminating epoxy is very thin because it must easily
saturate the fiberglass; it won't stay in a joint without being thickened.)
And no, trying to reattach a fork prong without any reinforcement would be a
fools errand.
System Three 5-minute epoxy. Don't get the wood filler, just the 2-part
epoxy. Not only will it fix your salad tongs, it makes a marvelous
clear grain filler for red oak (in my opinion). You squeeze out the
viscous stuff from each tube to a 1:1 ratio into a small container and
then mix well---I find that small wax-paper cups work marvelously, and I
mix with small (1/2"x1/4"x6", e.g.) scraps from whatever project I'm on.
Slather it on and don't clamp too tightly. WEAR BREATHING PROTECTION,
as uncured epoxy is quite toxic.
When you fix the tine, don't clamp it. In fact, if you can, try
drilling a teeny hole into both the tine and the fork base, pack in some
of the epoxy and insert a short piece of wire as a dowel. If the olive
is fairly oily, clean the parts to be joined with mineral spirits first
and let dry.
Fit as well as you can and hold it (don't clamp) for 5-10 minutes,
depending on ambient temp. Let sit for an hour. I think you'll be
happy with it. I find it a little harder than red oak when sanding, so
be careful where it meets the wood. Might be softer than olive.
Jason Lewis wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I have seen some wood workers use a colourless transparant epoxy for
> filling holes in wood. They said it was the same hardness as the wood
> and easily sanded.
>
> Where might I find such a product and what would it be called?
>
> I have a very nice set of salad servers made from olive wood, and
> unfortunately, one of the tines on the fork cracked and broke off, I'm
> hoping to use this product to repair it. It appears as though there was
> a natural fault in the wood at that spot which caused it to break. Will
> i be able to use such a product to repair this permanently?
>
> Thanks for any advice,
>
> Jason
Jason Lewis <[email protected]> wrote in
news:[email protected]:
<snip>
> I have a very nice set of salad servers made from olive wood, and
> unfortunately, one of the tines on the fork cracked and broke off,
I think what you will end up with is going to be mostly decorative. Olive
wood is usually going to do what you have already experienced. My
suggestion is that you repair this, and then display, not use the pieces.
Patriarch
Michael Daly wrote:
> On 22-Jul-2004, Jason Lewis <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> I'll endeavour to find some epoxy like the system three at the hardware
>> store here (in Australia)
>
> You're not likely to find that kind of epoxy in a hardware store. Your
> best bet is a marine supply place. One of the biggest problems with
> those brands (MAS, System 3, West etc) is they don't often sell in small
> quantities. It's easy to get a liter or more, but a quarter liter
> is another thing. I think West Systems makes a small repair kit,
> but I've never seen it in marine shops near me. Hope you're luckier.
One source for structural adhesives is Aircraft Spruce and Specialty
<http://www.aircraftspruce.com/australia.php>, which has made special
arrangements for Australian customers--delivery won't be quick but you
won't pay UPS shipping from the US either.
>
> Mike
--
--John
Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
Larry Jaques wrote:
> On Fri, 23 Jul 2004 17:09:23 GMT, "Lew Hodgett"
> <[email protected]> calmly ranted:
>
>>> Average drum price?
>>
>>How many drums do you want to buy?
>
> Curiosity has no number, sir. 1?
But price breaks do. Generally if you buy a hundred of something the price
is lower than if you buy one.
> ---------------------------------------------------
> I drive way too fast to worry about my cholesterol.
> ---------------------------------------------------
> http://www.diversify.com Refreshing Graphic Design
--
--John
Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
On Fri, 23 Jul 2004 17:09:23 GMT, "Lew Hodgett"
<[email protected]> calmly ranted:
>> Average drum price?
>
>How many drums do you want to buy?
Curiosity has no number, sir. 1?
---------------------------------------------------
I drive way too fast to worry about my cholesterol.
---------------------------------------------------
http://www.diversify.com Refreshing Graphic Design
"Elwood Dowd" writes:
> Slather it on and don't clamp too tightly. WEAR BREATHING PROTECTION,
> as uncured epoxy is quite toxic.
Nonsense.
Laminating epoxy contains no VOC's.
You should wear protective clothing to avoid developing contact
dertermatitus when exposed to the amine hardners, but that is a different
issue..
5 minute epoxy is inherently weaker than slower curing products.
Mineral spirits and epoxy don't mix.
If you must clean an oily wood like teak, then wear protective clothing and
use acetone.
And yes, use only modest clamping pressure.
Less clamping is better than more when using epoxy.
HTH
--
Lew
S/A: Challenge, The Bullet Proof Boat, (Under Construction in the Southland)
Visit: <http://home.earthlink.net/~lewhodgett> for Pictures
"Jason Lewis" writes:
> I have seen some wood workers use a colourless transparant epoxy for
> filling holes in wood. They said it was the same hardness as the wood
> and easily sanded.
>
> Where might I find such a product and what would it be called?
It would be called "epoxy"<G>.
Epoxy is by design, a clear liquid unless you and a pigment color to it.
Don't know where you are but it appears to be outside the US.
Do you have any boat builders in your area?
If so, try to find the WEST system epoxy from the Gougeon Bros.
They also have a web site where you can get tech assistance.
HTH
--
Lew
S/A: Challenge, The Bullet Proof Boat, (Under Construction in the Southland)
Visit: <http://home.earthlink.net/~lewhodgett> for Pictures
On Thu, 22 Jul 2004 03:11:11 GMT, "Lew Hodgett"
<[email protected]> calmly ranted:
-big snip-
>If so, try to find the WEST system epoxy from the Gougeon Bros.
>
>They also have a web site where you can get tech assistance.
Have you tried System 3 or MAS epoxies? If so, how do they compare?
Best pricing on epoxy comes from ________?
---------------------------------------------------
I drive way too fast to worry about my cholesterol.
---------------------------------------------------
http://www.diversify.com Refreshing Graphic Design
Lew Hodgett wrote:
> "Elwood Dowd" writes:
>>as uncured epoxy is quite toxic.
>
> Nonsense.
>
> Laminating epoxy contains no VOC's.
Well, we are talking about epoxy glues here, not laminating epoxies, but
I doubt that makes much of a difference. VOCs are not the only measure
of toxicity.
Many, many people have damaged their lungs due to contact with epoxy.
This is a well-known problem with boatbuilders and homebuilt aircraft
builders. It is quite common to develop a sensitivity to the stuff as
well that will affect the rest of your life. Happened to a boatbuilder
friend---he developed both asthma and a general chemical sensitivity. I
have seen him double over in agony after riding one floor in an elevator
with someone wearing perfume that I could barely smell. It is not a
pretty sight. I wear a vapor respirator now around anything that has to
cure in my presence.
Don't take my word for it; I'm not a chemist nor a toxicologist.
Here is a government report on the subject:
http://www.dhs.ca.gov/ohb/HESIS/epoxy.htm
Here is a link to the material safety data sheet for System 3 two-part
epoxy glue:
http://www.systemthree.com/msds/MSDS_SystemThree_Resin.pdf
Here is a list of stories from boatbuilders who have become sensitized
to the "non-toxic" hazardous chemicals in laminating epoxy:
http://www.fram.nl/workshop/controlled_vacuum_infusion/allergy.htm
Also---latex gloves pass some of the chemicals through to your skin.
Use nitrile or vinyl gloves. There is also a barrier cream that goes on
very easily that is reported to help tremendously.
Here is a link from the Glen-L boat kit company on the subject:
http://www.glen-l.com/supplies/pxman-safety.html
> 5 minute epoxy is inherently weaker than slower curing products.
> Mineral spirits and epoxy don't mix..<snip>..use acetone
Both of these are good advice, though I doubt anything stronger than
5-minute cure would be needed for a salad fork. BTW, I also wear a
vapor respirator using acetone.
In truth, I find it hard to believe someone would actually advocate
*against* wearing safety equipment when using potent chemicals, but
there's the net for you.
"Elwood Dowd" writes:
> Well, we are talking about epoxy glues here, not laminating epoxies, but
> I doubt that makes much of a difference. VOCs are not the only measure
> of toxicity.
>
> Many, many people have damaged their lungs due to contact with epoxy.
> This is a well-known problem with boatbuilders and homebuilt aircraft
> builders. It is quite common to develop a sensitivity to the stuff as
> well that will affect the rest of your life. Happened to a boatbuilder
> friend---he developed both asthma and a general chemical sensitivity. I
> have seen him double over in agony after riding one floor in an elevator
> with someone wearing perfume that I could barely smell. It is not a
> pretty sight. I wear a vapor respirator now around anything that has to
> cure in my presence.
Before the resin cures, there are no vapors to be concerned with; however,
having said that, protective clothing needs to be worn to avoid mixed but
uncured resin from coming in contact with the skin.
After the resin has kicked but before having cured for about a week (AKA:
green state), the dust created from sanding is a real problem and if you
don't wear a dust mask, can cause all the problems you describe above.
After about a week of curing, the sanding dust is not as serious a problem,
but a dust mask is still required.
> Don't take my word for it; I'm not a chemist nor a toxicologist.
Neither am I.
> Also---latex gloves pass some of the chemicals through to your skin.
> Use nitrile or vinyl gloves.
Actually, I use two (2) sets of gloves, a latex surgical type pair covered
by a pair of what are known as "canner's gloves" which has a cuff just above
the wrist.
When I'm finished, remove the canner's gloves leaving the clean latex glove
to be used to remove the disposable suit and shoes.
> There is also a barrier cream that goes on
> very easily that is reported to help tremendously.
I've tried several, none seem to work for me.
> Both of these are good advice, though I doubt anything stronger than
> 5-minute cure would be needed for a salad fork. BTW, I also wear a
> vapor respirator using acetone.
I don't even keep acetone in the boat yard.
> In truth, I find it hard to believe someone would actually advocate
> *against* wearing safety equipment when using potent chemicals, but
> there's the net for you.
I'm definitely advocating that proper safety clothing needs to be worn when
working with epoxy; however, a respirator is not required when applying
laminating resin (glue).
OTOH, there are epoxy based coatings such as high build primer, "tank
resin", etc that definitely do contain VOC's.
If you are working with these products, especially in an enclosed area, a
good respirator is an absolute must.
It all depends on what you are doing.
--
Lew
S/A: Challenge, The Bullet Proof Boat, (Under Construction in the Southland)
Visit: <http://home.earthlink.net/~lewhodgett> for Pictures