What's the consensus?
I bought an item which, three weeks later, the seller said was sent over
two weeks ago. Says it must have gotten lost.
I asked originally for a tracking number, seller said no.
Now the seller is offering the shipping charge refunded.
I want to leave a negative, because
a. This doesn't happen and I suspect they are disorganized
or dishonest.
b. Offering the shipping is a slap in the face.
c. That's just not how it's done in my world, give me a
full refund if you want to make it right.
d. I'm also just irritated at the time spent, in vain.
What would you do?
Also, I think I should carry this out through arbitration in the hope of
getting a full refund... but I don't know if ebay's arbitrators feel the
same way I do about these matters. Never done this before (never had
to.) Does anyone have any ideas about that?
er
--
email not valid
Enoch Root wrote:
> What's the consensus?
>
> I bought an item which, three weeks later, the seller said was sent over
> two weeks ago. Says it must have gotten lost.
>
> I asked originally for a tracking number, seller said no.
Ridiculous. If the shipping co, lost it, the tracking # would say so.
> Now the seller is offering the shipping charge refunded.
What a nice guy.
>
> I want to leave a negative, because
>
> a. This doesn't happen and I suspect they are disorganized
> or dishonest.
> b. Offering the shipping is a slap in the face.
> c. That's just not how it's done in my world, give me a
> full refund if you want to make it right.
> d. I'm also just irritated at the time spent, in vain.
>
> What would you do?
INSIST on a tracking #. After all, if it was shipped, he can prove it,
therefore it would be your problem or the shipping co's and not his.
If he can't provide a tracking #, he's ripping you off.
What's the ebay item #?
I'd be curious what the sellers feedback rating is. If this has
happened before it should show up there.
I buy and sell on ebay and have only had one problem (crosses fingers,
knocks on wood, etc...) I bought an item and it never showed up.
After a bunch of emails and excuses I emailed a couple of the person's
previous buyers and found out that the excuses they were feeding me
weren't new ones... I filed negative feedback but didn't bother with
the arbitration, the amount was $7 and I didn't think it was worth the
time and hassle for that amount.
I'd do a little research with previous buyers, I got answers from
almost everyone I sent one too asking.
Good luck.
B a r r y wrote:
> Larry Bud wrote:
>
> > If he can't provide a tracking #, he's ripping you off.
>
> What if he mailed it?
>
> There are plenty of eBay sellers who are private folks, just like you
> and me, as opposed to businesses. I've shipped over a hundred packages
> for eBay auctions of my personal stuff via Priority Mail, so no tracking
> number was available.
Since when?
Priority mail is tracked.
http://www.usps.com/shipping/trackandconfirm.htm
The post office gives receipts, and often they show destination
information.
I've had ONE package ordered from Ebay out of about 100 that was lost
in the mail for 3 months. Bought it from MJD Auctions and it was
shipped media mail. Literally 3 months before it showed up with a post
mark from they day they said they shipped it.
They had shipped me a new one since then, so by mutual consent it was
refused and returned to sender.
A full refund is in order, and your integrity to repay it if the
original item arrives eventually.
Alan
I have a little experience with ebay/paypal disputes, but not in the
last 6 months, so I don't know what policy changes might have happened
since then. The last time I disputed, it was OK to file a chargeback
with your credit card company as long as you went through the
ebay/paypal dispute process first. Anyway, here is some input:
- It is perfectly valid for the seller to self-insure. Just because
they charged an insurance fee doesn't mean they have to use a 3rd-party
to insure.
- DON'T leave negative feedback until the issue is resolved. Since you
paid by check, it will be difficult enough to get your money back. Once
you leave negative feedback, you've greatly decreased the sellers
incentive to work with you.
- I know this doesn't help you now, but in the future, ALWAYS pay by
credit card for amounts you're not willing to lose. This gives you the
last resort of filing a chargeback with your credit card company. I've
had to do it for an ebay purchase, and it works (and I'm still able to
use ebay and paypal).
I wouldn't bother with ebay arbitration. Been there, done that. It
don't work even if they do sucker you into paying the $20 bucks for an
arbitrator. It still don't work. I had a case against a guy for item
that arrived damaged but the box was in perfect shape. He wanted me to
damage the box so he could collect the insurance money from UPS. He
was a freaking shister and Ebay wouldn't do a thing about it. They
won't because he's one of their own.
I agree with the others who said if he can't supply you with a tracking
# then hit him with the negative response. Unfortunately, it's about
all you can do.
Bryan
Enoch Root wrote:
> What's the consensus?
>
> I bought an item which, three weeks later, the seller said was sent over
> two weeks ago. Says it must have gotten lost.
>
> I asked originally for a tracking number, seller said no.
>
> Now the seller is offering the shipping charge refunded.
>
> I want to leave a negative, because
>
> a. This doesn't happen and I suspect they are disorganized
> or dishonest.
> b. Offering the shipping is a slap in the face.
> c. That's just not how it's done in my world, give me a
> full refund if you want to make it right.
> d. I'm also just irritated at the time spent, in vain.
>
> What would you do?
>
> Also, I think I should carry this out through arbitration in the hope of
> getting a full refund... but I don't know if ebay's arbitrators feel the
> same way I do about these matters. Never done this before (never had
> to.) Does anyone have any ideas about that?
>
> er
> --
> email not valid
There are things you can do. You should go to the ebay Answer Center or
Discussion Boards to get much more informed advice. You still have a
chance of getting a refund. Have you followed ebays "Item Not Received
or Significantly Not as Described Process"? This doesn't cost you
anything.
http://pages.ebay.com/help/tp/inr-snad-process.html
Remember, don't leave negative feedback until the issue is resolved or
you have just completely given up on getting your money back.
> That's like the nightmare scenario I'd envisioned when I posted my query.
>
> Now I can (at least) put my fears to rest, because the package arrived.
>
> Let me just say... this seller was inaccurate in her emails, and this is
> what caused me all the worry. It wasn't because I thought she was a
> liar or anything, it was the inconsistencies between what she reported
> and what actually happened that led to my worries.
People need to be honeset in their feedback, otherwise it's useless.
You should have put that "communication was terrible, package shipped 1
week after seller said it did, ignored emails", and her a neutral.
Now that you're able to reply to feedback, if she gives you a
retaliatory bad rating, you can explain why (i.e. "seller is pissed I
have her a neutral for slow shipping")
B a r r y <[email protected]> writes:
>Larry Bud wrote:
>> If he can't provide a tracking #, he's ripping you off.
>What if he mailed it?
USPS offers delivery notification for I think 45 cents. Not sure if it
can be used for first class mail or just priority.
As an Ebay seller, I would never ship something without tracking. I try
my best never to buy anything that will be shipped without tracking.
If the seller doesn't use tracking, they should be held liable if the item
doesn't show up.
Brian Elfert
Enoch Root <[email protected]> writes:
>What's the consensus?
>I bought an item which, three weeks later, the seller said was sent over
>two weeks ago. Says it must have gotten lost.
>I asked originally for a tracking number, seller said no.
I learned the hard way never to send anything without tracking. I sent a
$180 item for upgrade via Priority Mail and didn't use the delivery
notification. The addressee claimed to never have received it.
For all I know, the guy got it and just told me he never got it. Others
had accused the guy of some shady stuff in the past. Delivery
conmfirmation would at least prove it got to his mailbox.
Brian Elfert
In article <[email protected]>,
Enoch Root <[email protected]> wrote:
>bremen68 wrote:
>> I'd be curious what the sellers feedback rating is. If this has
>> happened before it should show up there.
>>
>> I buy and sell on ebay and have only had one problem (crosses fingers,
>> knocks on wood, etc...) I bought an item and it never showed up.
>> After a bunch of emails and excuses I emailed a couple of the person's
>> previous buyers and found out that the excuses they were feeding me
>> weren't new ones... I filed negative feedback but didn't bother with
>> the arbitration, the amount was $7 and I didn't think it was worth the
>> time and hassle for that amount.
>
>This is similar... a $20 item (spokeshave, #54, with adjustable throat,
>and it looks like a pre-sweetheart because New Britain is mentioned in
>the ad) plus $10 to ship.
>
>The feedback was a tough call, one bad (that wasn't really bad) out of
>150: too new to ebay to really get a sense of their integrity, and I
>made a judgment call.
>
>The person has left me feedback already, so at least I can weigh the
>decision without having a possible negative hanging over my head.
>
>This also complicates things, however, as I seek out and respond
>generally favorably to sellers that do that, even when things aren't
>completely to my satisfaction.
>
>> I'd do a little research with previous buyers, I got answers from
>> almost everyone I sent one too asking.
>
>I never considered contacting the previous buyers, that's a good idea.
>
>Offering me only the shipping in return for this gets my goat. The ad
>specifically says I'm paying for insurance in addition to shipping with
>that $10.
With _that_ information, the situation is REALLY simple.
If you paid for insurance, and the packeage was 'lost', then the
insurance applies. and the insurer pays for the lost item cost.
If the seller 'forgot' to order the insurance *you* paid for, then
that is the seller's problem.
They owe you the *full*price* (inluding shipping) of the item.
'arbitration' should be a 'no brainer' given _that_ 'minor detail'. :)
The other option, if you're going to have occasion to visit the seller's
locale any time soon, is to file a small claims action in the court
where they live.
In article <[email protected]>,
B a r r y <[email protected]> wrote:
>Larry Bud wrote:
>> B a r r y wrote:
>>> Larry Bud wrote:
>>>
>>>> If he can't provide a tracking #, he's ripping you off.
>>> What if he mailed it?
>>>
>>> There are plenty of eBay sellers who are private folks, just like you
>>> and me, as opposed to businesses. I've shipped over a hundred packages
>>> for eBay auctions of my personal stuff via Priority Mail, so no tracking
>>> number was available.
>>
>> Since when?
>>
>> Priority mail is tracked.
>> http://www.usps.com/shipping/trackandconfirm.htm
>>
>
>No, it's not. <G>
>
>That service is an extra cost add-on. It isn't (or at least wasn't the
>last time I used it at Christmas) included by default.
>
>The clerk will ask "any tracking or delivery confirmation?"
"insured" packages are *always* tracked. this seller was charging extra
for _required_ insurance.
Either he's engaged in fraudulent misrepresentation of his business
dealings, or there is a 'tracking number', no two ways about it.
"Bruce T" <[email protected]> writes:
>Sears, JC Penny, etc.) don't pay for insurance since they know that the cost
>of the insurance is greater than the cost of the (occasional) lost
>item...it's just statistics. However, I believe that they ALL use some form
>of tracking.
I'm fairly certain the USPS has zero tracking on first class, priority
mail, and parcel post unless you request it and pay for it.
The USPS apparently lost a shipment of mine about two years ago. I filed
a lost mail form and never heard anything. If they had tracking, don't
you think they could at least tell me the last place it was scanned?
Brian Elfert
In article <[email protected]>,
Enoch Root <[email protected]> wrote:
>Leon wrote:
>> "Enoch Root" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> news:[email protected]...
>>
>>
>>>What would you do?
>>
>>
>>
>> Contest the charge to your credit card company.
>
>Paid by check. :(
>
That offers you some other options --
Tell the seller either:
1) he makes good on the "insurance" you paid him for
-or-
2) you file a _criminal_complaint_ against him with
the USPS for 'mail fraud'.
if/when you file with the USPS, be sure to include the
fact you paid the seller for insurance against loss/damage
and he has failed to provide the goods *or* the insurance
coverage. That's *two* fraud counts, if it comes to that.
Enoch Root wrote:
>> As a result, I couldn't sign
>> on to leave a negative eval, and later I noticed that this seller had
>> very few evals, and no negative ones.
>>
>
> But it arrived, and I gave her a positive since I'm only judging on
> shipping speed
Am I missing something here? You couldn't sign on - then you gave her
positive feedback?
--
It's turtles, all the way down
The ebay website has changed since since I challenged a non-delivered
purchase. The web site now in one place does tell members with problems to
contact their credit card company, but in another place says that buyers
must not interfere with ebay's business.
In my case I ordered an inexpensive product -- $30 -- and paid for it with
my AmEx card. The item didn't arrive (although the seller claimed to have
shipped it, uninsured) and I informed ebay of the problem. I got one e-mail
from the seller, saying that the item had been shipped and they didn't know
what to do now, but weren't going to offer a refund. Ebay said there would
be a 45 day period for their investigation, but my credit card bill was due
within 25 days. When it became obvious that ebay wasn't going to complete
anything before my credit card bill came due, I notified AmEx that the item
had never been delivered. They removed it from my bill and notified ebay.
Next, I got a tersely worded notice from Ebay that said buyers' terms of
reference did not allow challenges to charges made to credit cards, that I
was barred from using their site, that if I signed on under a different name
they would take further action, and that if I had any further questions I
should contact their legal department. This was eBay's reaction to my
challenge to an undelivered $30 item. As a result, I couldn't sign on to
leave a negative eval, and later I noticed that this seller had very few
evals, and no negative ones.
As I read the Ebay User Agreement and Privacy Policy (located at
https://scgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?RegisterEnterInfo&siteid=0&co_partnerid=2&UsingSSL=1, I
don't see any specific reference anymore banning challenging credit card
charges, but several areas where that policy would be the logical result of
an overall policy statement.
Maybe eBay has changed their egregious policy since my problems with it, but
I don't find anything on eBay that I can't find elsewhere at comparable
prices, so I've never tried to reinitiate an account.
"Mike Berger" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Can you cite this Ebay policy? I've disputed a couple of charges
> directly with the credit card company and am still an active Ebay
> user. I also got my money back both times.
>
> JimR wrote:
>
>> WARNING -- if you contest a charge with your credit card company --
>>
>> -- E-Bay will block you from any further access to the E-Bay site,
>> you will not be able to buy/sell on E-Bay, and you will not be able to
>> leave a negative feedback to warn others of the seller's problems.
>>
>> E-Bays rules specifically state that buyers ARE NOT ALLOWED to contest
>> credit card purchases. (FYI, this E-Bay policy is a violation of credit
>> card companies' card use policies.)
>>
>> This is one of several ways in which E-Bay makes it difficult to leave
>> negative feedbacks -- presumably because negatives also make E-Bay look
>> bad. One result -- don't give too much credence to a low number of
>> negatives --
>>
I would certainly suggest mentioning that you are considering leaving
negative feedback if this is not resolved to your liking. I've only had one
problem on Ebay so far. I ordered an camper oven that was listed as "brand
new, never used or installed" Upon arrival, it was clearly used, there was
much grease on the insides of the oven, some small rust spots, etc. Anyway,
I contacted the seller who said that THEY never used it, and furthermore,
bought it secondhand. That really ground my beans. To make a long story
short, I emailed the seller pictures of the problems, and soon filed a
complaint with Ebay. Finally, the problem still unresolved, I told the
seller what I thought would be a fair market value for this used item, (for
a partial refund) and I'd leave negative feedback if we couldn't resovle
this soon. She quickly sent a check for the refund I suggested.
I believe it was the threat of leaving negative feedback that did the
trick. No one wants that! Especially for a $7 (in your case) item. At this
point, it seems to me it's the SELLERS responsibility to PROVE that he did
ship the item, or risk negative feedback, complaint with Ebay,
etc..Communicate your course of action before you follow through, it may get
your money back. --dave
"Brian Elfert" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> "Bruce T" <[email protected]> writes:
>
>>Sears, JC Penny, etc.) don't pay for insurance since they know that the
>>cost
>>of the insurance is greater than the cost of the (occasional) lost
>>item...it's just statistics. However, I believe that they ALL use some
>>form
>>of tracking.
>
> I'm fairly certain the USPS has zero tracking on first class, priority
> mail, and parcel post unless you request it and pay for it.
>
> The USPS apparently lost a shipment of mine about two years ago. I filed
> a lost mail form and never heard anything. If they had tracking, don't
> you think they could at least tell me the last place it was scanned?
>
> Brian Elfert
Enoch Root wrote:
>>I'd do a little research with previous buyers, I got answers from
>>almost everyone I sent one too asking.
>
> I never considered contacting the previous buyers, that's a good idea.
>
> Offering me only the shipping in return for this gets my goat. The ad
> specifically says I'm paying for insurance in addition to shipping with
> that $10.
Yeah, I'm with everyone else on this. If there weren't any insurance
mentioned, then it's a tough call, and I'd say it the loss was probably
yours to eat. On the other hand, with the promise of insurance, I think
the seller needs to either reimburse _all_ your money or provide you
with the means to make an insurance claim against the shipper.
If the seller does not provide you that information, then they are quite
simply not providing you with the stated goods, as insurance is
irrelevant without the information to claim it.
- Brooks
--
The "bmoses-nospam" address is valid; no unmunging needed.
Mike Berger wrote:
> Can you cite this Ebay policy? I've disputed a couple of charges
> directly with the credit card company and am still an active Ebay
> user. I also got my money back both times.
I suspect this is eBay policy only for credit card payments that go
through PayPal, not ones that go directly to the seller. (Remember that
eBay owns PayPal now, so that gets all lumped together.)
That one sort of makes sense, because when the credit card payment goes
through PayPal and you then contest the charge, PayPal has already paid
the seller and if the credit card company doesn't pay them, they're the
ones who get stiffed, not the seller -- even though they delivered
exactly what you asked for.
Disclaimer: I haven't actually looked this up.
- Brooks
--
The "bmoses-nospam" address is valid; no unmunging needed.
Larry Blanchard wrote:
> Enoch Root wrote:
>>>As a result, I couldn't sign
>>>on to leave a negative eval, and later I noticed that this seller had
>>>very few evals, and no negative ones.
>>>
>
>>But it arrived, and I gave her a positive since I'm only judging on
>>shipping speed
>
> Am I missing something here? You couldn't sign on - then you gave her
> positive feedback?
You're missing something. The top paragraph was written by JimR, and
the second one by Enoch. You can tell by the differing number of ">"s
in front of them that they came from different posts.
- Brooks
--
The "bmoses-nospam" address is valid; no unmunging needed.
Enoch Root wrote:
> Larry Bud wrote:
>>Now that you're able to reply to feedback, if she gives you a
>>retaliatory bad rating, you can explain why (i.e. "seller is pissed I
>>have her a neutral for slow shipping")
>
> On the other hand, I think feedback ratings are absurdly at variance
> with what I'd imagine it to be: and average experience gets a neutral,
> something above and beyond the call would rate a plus.
>
> But I'm content to do like everyone else, and analyze the feedback
> comments and call 98.6% marginal.
Yeah. What I find most useful, if I'm concerned, is to look through the
old feedback until I find a couple of the non-positive entries, and see
what they say -- and particularly see how the seller replies.
A few sellers, all it takes is looking at their replies to the negative
feedback they get, and it's clear as daylight that I don't want to do
business with them.
- Brooks
--
The "bmoses-nospam" address is valid; no unmunging needed.
Larry Bud wrote:
> If he can't provide a tracking #, he's ripping you off.
What if he mailed it?
There are plenty of eBay sellers who are private folks, just like you
and me, as opposed to businesses. I've shipped over a hundred packages
for eBay auctions of my personal stuff via Priority Mail, so no tracking
number was available.
I would expect a full refund if I didn't get the item, but the lack of a
tracking number does not automatically mean FRAUD.
Barry
On Wed, 25 Jan 2006 11:05:07 -0800, with neither quill nor qualm,
Enoch Root <[email protected]> quickly quoth:
>What's the consensus?
Consensus on the WRECK? Bwahahahahahaha!
>I bought an item which, three weeks later, the seller said was sent over
>two weeks ago. Says it must have gotten lost.
>
>I asked originally for a tracking number, seller said no.
If you asked for insurance/tracking and he wouldn't provide it,
AND you didn't receive the package, I would definitely take it
through eBay arbitration. Make sure the offer to refund shipping
is included in your claim. It's showing that the shipper is willing
to negotiate and/or is accerpting blame. Include email text of your
request for tracking and his refusal. Give the arbitrators all
the ducks in a row to help them make a clear decision in your
direction.
After that decision comes through, you can decide how you'll deal with
the feedback issue.
---
Annoy a politician: Be trustworthy, faithful, and honest!
---
http://www.diversify.com Comprehensive Website Development
bremen68 wrote:
> I'd be curious what the sellers feedback rating is. If this has
> happened before it should show up there.
>
> I buy and sell on ebay and have only had one problem (crosses fingers,
> knocks on wood, etc...) I bought an item and it never showed up.
> After a bunch of emails and excuses I emailed a couple of the person's
> previous buyers and found out that the excuses they were feeding me
> weren't new ones... I filed negative feedback but didn't bother with
> the arbitration, the amount was $7 and I didn't think it was worth the
> time and hassle for that amount.
This is similar... a $20 item (spokeshave, #54, with adjustable throat,
and it looks like a pre-sweetheart because New Britain is mentioned in
the ad) plus $10 to ship.
The feedback was a tough call, one bad (that wasn't really bad) out of
150: too new to ebay to really get a sense of their integrity, and I
made a judgment call.
The person has left me feedback already, so at least I can weigh the
decision without having a possible negative hanging over my head.
This also complicates things, however, as I seek out and respond
generally favorably to sellers that do that, even when things aren't
completely to my satisfaction.
> I'd do a little research with previous buyers, I got answers from
> almost everyone I sent one too asking.
I never considered contacting the previous buyers, that's a good idea.
Offering me only the shipping in return for this gets my goat. The ad
specifically says I'm paying for insurance in addition to shipping with
that $10.
er
--
email not valid
"Enoch Root" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> todd wrote:
>
>> If you purchase insurance, tracking is included de facto, IIRC.
>
> That's what I thought (about USPS). Damn strange. I'm betting the
> "insurance" I bought (for him/her) is pocketed.
>
> er
> --
> email not valid
I recall reading feedback on a seller who must have had a large volume of
sales. Several people beefed that he offered shipping insurance, but the
shipments arrived without the insurance sticker from the shipping company.
The seller's explanation was that he never said he provided insurance from
the shipping company and was instead "self-insuring" the shipments. I'm not
suggesting that happened in this case, but this just reminded me of that.
The only insurance issue I had was when I was selling my wife's collection
of porcelain angel figurines. I definitely required shipping on those and
of the 30 or 40 that I shipped, one arrived damaged. The buyer took it to
the post office, who agreed that it had been packed appropriately. I sent
him the insurance info and he took care of the rest.
I've never been involved in a dispute on an eBay transaction. I'm
interested to hear about your experience in getting eBay to honor their
commitment to protect buyers.
todd
JimR wrote:
> The ebay website has changed since since I challenged a non-delivered
> purchase. The web site now in one place does tell members with problems to
> contact their credit card company, but in another place says that buyers
> must not interfere with ebay's business.
>
> In my case I ordered an inexpensive product -- $30 -- and paid for it with
> my AmEx card. The item didn't arrive (although the seller claimed to have
> shipped it, uninsured) and I informed ebay of the problem. I got one e-mail
> from the seller, saying that the item had been shipped and they didn't know
> what to do now, but weren't going to offer a refund. Ebay said there would
> be a 45 day period for their investigation, but my credit card bill was due
> within 25 days. When it became obvious that ebay wasn't going to complete
> anything before my credit card bill came due, I notified AmEx that the item
> had never been delivered. They removed it from my bill and notified ebay.
>
> Next, I got a tersely worded notice from Ebay that said buyers' terms of
> reference did not allow challenges to charges made to credit cards, that I
> was barred from using their site, that if I signed on under a different name
> they would take further action, and that if I had any further questions I
> should contact their legal department. This was eBay's reaction to my
> challenge to an undelivered $30 item. As a result, I couldn't sign on to
> leave a negative eval, and later I noticed that this seller had very few
> evals, and no negative ones.
>
> As I read the Ebay User Agreement and Privacy Policy (located at
> https://scgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?RegisterEnterInfo&siteid=0&co_partnerid=2&UsingSSL=1, I
> don't see any specific reference anymore banning challenging credit card
> charges, but several areas where that policy would be the logical result of
> an overall policy statement.
That's like the nightmare scenario I'd envisioned when I posted my query.
Now I can (at least) put my fears to rest, because the package arrived.
Let me just say... this seller was inaccurate in her emails, and this is
what caused me all the worry. It wasn't because I thought she was a
liar or anything, it was the inconsistencies between what she reported
and what actually happened that led to my worries.
She claimed to have sent it out almost a week before she actually did,
apparently preferring to pretend she'd done what she said she would
"before my check arrived".
I had also sent an email asking if the check had arrived, long enough
after having sent it that it must have gotten there a some days before.
No, it hadn't, she said. She later sent an email confirming that it'd
arrived that day and she was sending the item the following day (which
as I said didn't happen.)
But it arrived, and I gave her a positive since I'm only judging on
shipping speed (I probably would've waited this long had she opted to
let the check clear first), packaging, and accuracy of the description
(including omissions).
She's disorganized, and she wants to hide her little inconsequential
faults. Big deal.
er
--
email not valid
Larry Bud wrote:
>>That's like the nightmare scenario I'd envisioned when I posted my query.
>>
>>Now I can (at least) put my fears to rest, because the package arrived.
>>
>>Let me just say... this seller was inaccurate in her emails, and this is
>>what caused me all the worry. It wasn't because I thought she was a
>>liar or anything, it was the inconsistencies between what she reported
>>and what actually happened that led to my worries.
>
>
> People need to be honeset in their feedback, otherwise it's useless.
> You should have put that "communication was terrible, package shipped 1
> week after seller said it did, ignored emails", and her a neutral.
I was honest.
> Now that you're able to reply to feedback, if she gives you a
> retaliatory bad rating, you can explain why (i.e. "seller is pissed I
> have her a neutral for slow shipping")
I didn't think shipping was slow.
er
--
email not valid
True, you didn't. But you were seeking advice and were strongly advised
by some to do so. I guess I could have been more clear in complimenting
you on the judgment you exercised. :-) Oh well. Time to make some sawdust!
J.
Enoch Root wrote:
> John wrote:
>> Good thing for you that you didn't accuse her of fraud.
>
> I don't think I ever intimated I'd do anything like that... but who
> knows, I'm as likely to leave something unsaid as the next... and there
> is where the imagination takes wing.
>
> er
So, if you had ordered this item from Sears, for example, would you do
anything differently? I suspect that you'd be fighting like hell to get the
merchandise that you paid for. So why are you treating a private seller any
differently? It seems to me that the SELLER has the responsibility to get
the merchanndise to you since they accepted your money. Big companies (like
Sears, JC Penny, etc.) don't pay for insurance since they know that the cost
of the insurance is greater than the cost of the (occasional) lost
item...it's just statistics. However, I believe that they ALL use some form
of tracking.
BruceT
"Enoch Root" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> What's the consensus?
>
> I bought an item which, three weeks later, the seller said was sent over
> two weeks ago. Says it must have gotten lost.
>
> I asked originally for a tracking number, seller said no.
>
> Now the seller is offering the shipping charge refunded.
>
> I want to leave a negative, because
>
> a. This doesn't happen and I suspect they are disorganized
> or dishonest.
> b. Offering the shipping is a slap in the face.
> c. That's just not how it's done in my world, give me a
> full refund if you want to make it right.
> d. I'm also just irritated at the time spent, in vain.
>
> What would you do?
>
> Also, I think I should carry this out through arbitration in the hope of
> getting a full refund... but I don't know if ebay's arbitrators feel the
> same way I do about these matters. Never done this before (never had
> to.) Does anyone have any ideas about that?
>
> er
> --
> email not valid
"Enoch Root" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Offering me only the shipping in return for this gets my goat. The ad
> specifically says I'm paying for insurance in addition to shipping with
> that $10.
>
> er
I'm with Robert. My first question after reading the original post was if
you paid for insurance. If you did, (and if the shipment was truly lost)
then the seller must provide you the means by which to contact the insurer
to recover your loss. If the seller won't provide that information, then he
is, frankly, a fucking liar. You didn't mention how you paid for this item.
If you paid via PayPal, there are additional courses of action for
resolution of your problem on top of those already stated.
todd
Larry Bud wrote:
> Now that you're able to reply to feedback, if she gives you a
> retaliatory bad rating, you can explain why (i.e. "seller is pissed I
> have her a neutral for slow shipping")
On the other hand, I think feedback ratings are absurdly at variance
with what I'd imagine it to be: and average experience gets a neutral,
something above and beyond the call would rate a plus.
But I'm content to do like everyone else, and analyze the feedback
comments and call 98.6% marginal.
er
--
email not valid
Larry Jaques wrote:
> On Wed, 25 Jan 2006 11:05:07 -0800, with neither quill nor qualm,
> Enoch Root <[email protected]> quickly quoth:
>
>
>>What's the consensus?
>
>
> Consensus on the WRECK? Bwahahahahahaha!
Now I think on't, that is pretty damn silly.
er
--
email not valid
Larry Bud wrote:
> B a r r y wrote:
>> Larry Bud wrote:
>>
>>> If he can't provide a tracking #, he's ripping you off.
>> What if he mailed it?
>>
>> There are plenty of eBay sellers who are private folks, just like you
>> and me, as opposed to businesses. I've shipped over a hundred packages
>> for eBay auctions of my personal stuff via Priority Mail, so no tracking
>> number was available.
>
> Since when?
>
> Priority mail is tracked.
> http://www.usps.com/shipping/trackandconfirm.htm
>
No, it's not. <G>
That service is an extra cost add-on. It isn't (or at least wasn't the
last time I used it at Christmas) included by default.
The clerk will ask "any tracking or delivery confirmation?"
Barry
If you sent payment via US mail, you can file a complaint on the
USPS site. A call or letter from a Postal Inspector is often
enough to get action.
If the seller has no proof he sent the item, you should get a
complete refund. It's his responsibility, especially since
his "handling" charge included "insurance".
You should also file a "safe harbor" complaint with Ebay, but
they'll only let you file after a long wait and only give a
partial refund if they settle in your favor.
And leave that negative feedback. You've given the seller an
opportunity to make it right. At least you can help his
potential future victims.
Enoch Root wrote:
> What's the consensus?
>
> I bought an item which, three weeks later, the seller said was sent over
> two weeks ago. Says it must have gotten lost.
>
> I asked originally for a tracking number, seller said no.
>
> Now the seller is offering the shipping charge refunded.
>
> I want to leave a negative, because
>
Can you cite this Ebay policy? I've disputed a couple of charges
directly with the credit card company and am still an active Ebay
user. I also got my money back both times.
JimR wrote:
> WARNING -- if you contest a charge with your credit card company --
>
> -- E-Bay will block you from any further access to the E-Bay site, you
> will not be able to buy/sell on E-Bay, and you will not be able to leave a
> negative feedback to warn others of the seller's problems.
>
> E-Bays rules specifically state that buyers ARE NOT ALLOWED to contest
> credit card purchases. (FYI, this E-Bay policy is a violation of credit
> card companies' card use policies.)
>
> This is one of several ways in which E-Bay makes it difficult to leave
> negative feedbacks -- presumably because negatives also make E-Bay look bad.
> One result -- don't give too much credence to a low number of negatives --
>
>
"Self-insuring" isn't an uncommon practice. But if he's
going to pocket the money he'd better be willing to cover
the occasional discrepancy.
Enoch Root wrote:
> todd wrote:
>
>
>>If you purchase insurance, tracking is included de facto, IIRC.
>
>
> That's what I thought (about USPS). Damn strange. I'm betting the
> "insurance" I bought (for him/her) is pocketed.
>
> er
I'm not comfortable with Ebay owning Paypal. It seems
like a lot of potential for conflict of interest.
But I think things are different now. At one time credit
card charges to Paypal were considered the same as a "cash
advance" without the cash advance fee. The credit card
companies required me to dispute through Paypal. Over
the past couple of years they've treated them more like
payments to a store -- each one is a separate charge for
merchandise from a different vendor. So I've used the
standard dispute procedure.
The credit card companies want you to go through Ebay and
Paypal dispute because (a) they don't have to compensate
you for anything you get back from those sources first and
(b) Ebay requires a 45 day wait, which may take you beyond
the credit card dispute deadline.
Brooks Moses wrote:
> I suspect this is eBay policy only for credit card payments that go
> through PayPal, not ones that go directly to the seller. (Remember that
> eBay owns PayPal now, so that gets all lumped together.)
>
> That one sort of makes sense, because when the credit card payment goes
> through PayPal and you then contest the charge, PayPal has already paid
> the seller and if the credit card company doesn't pay them, they're the
> ones who get stiffed, not the seller -- even though they delivered
> exactly what you asked for.
Leon wrote:
> "Enoch Root" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>
>
>>What would you do?
>
>
>
> Contest the charge to your credit card company.
Paid by check. :(
er
--
email not valid
Larry Blanchard wrote:
> Enoch Root wrote:
>>>As a result, I couldn't sign
>>>on to leave a negative eval, and later I noticed that this seller had
>>>very few evals, and no negative ones.
>>But it arrived, and I gave her a positive since I'm only judging on
>>shipping speed
> Am I missing something here? You couldn't sign on - then you gave her
> positive feedback?
Your attributions are munged.
er
--
email not valid
"Enoch Root" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>>
>> Contest the charge to your credit card company.
>
> Paid by check. :(
WARNING -- if you contest a charge with your credit card company --
-- E-Bay will block you from any further access to the E-Bay site, you
will not be able to buy/sell on E-Bay, and you will not be able to leave a
negative feedback to warn others of the seller's problems.
E-Bays rules specifically state that buyers ARE NOT ALLOWED to contest
credit card purchases. (FYI, this E-Bay policy is a violation of credit
card companies' card use policies.)
This is one of several ways in which E-Bay makes it difficult to leave
negative feedbacks -- presumably because negatives also make E-Bay look bad.
One result -- don't give too much credence to a low number of negatives --
"Leuf" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Wed, 25 Jan 2006 11:05:07 -0800, Enoch Root <[email protected]>
>
>
> Proof of shipping would not be enough for him, he's got to have proof
> of *delivery* or the buyer wins.
Not if the sale was a scam.
On Wed, 25 Jan 2006 11:05:07 -0800, Enoch Root <[email protected]>
wrote:
>Also, I think I should carry this out through arbitration in the hope of
>getting a full refund... but I don't know if ebay's arbitrators feel the
>same way I do about these matters. Never done this before (never had
>to.) Does anyone have any ideas about that?
Proof of shipping would not be enough for him, he's got to have proof
of *delivery* or the buyer wins.
-Leuf
Good thing for you that you didn't accuse her of fraud.
You might direct her to this thread though. Perhaps it will instill a
bit of business sense into her to see how such behavior can be perceived
by others.
J.
Enoch Root wrote:
> Now I can (at least) put my fears to rest, because the package arrived.
> ...
> She's disorganized, and she wants to hide her little inconsequential
> faults.
"Brian Elfert" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> "Bruce T" <[email protected]> writes:
>
>>Sears, JC Penny, etc.) don't pay for insurance since they know that the
>>cost
>>of the insurance is greater than the cost of the (occasional) lost
>>item...it's just statistics. However, I believe that they ALL use some
>>form
>>of tracking.
>
> I'm fairly certain the USPS has zero tracking on first class, priority
> mail, and parcel post unless you request it and pay for it.
>
> The USPS apparently lost a shipment of mine about two years ago. I filed
> a lost mail form and never heard anything. If they had tracking, don't
> you think they could at least tell me the last place it was scanned?
>
> Brian Elfert
If you purchase insurance, tracking is included de facto, IIRC.
todd
"Enoch Root" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Leon wrote:
>> "Enoch Root" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> news:[email protected]...
>>
>>
>>>What would you do?
>>
>>
>>
>> Contest the charge to your credit card company.
>
> Paid by check. :(
>
> er
> --
> email not valid
This is a good lesson for anybody (not just you) about paying for things on
ebay. I have a paypal account just for this reason though it has come in
handy for a few other things like buying about $1000 worth of woodworking
tools for $450 from a fellow wreckie (back on topic?) since he was moving
soon, wouldn't accept a personal check, wasn't set up for credit cards and I
didn't have the cash on me.
Gary (glad you didn't get taken for a lot more)
"Enoch Root" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> What would you do?
Contest the charge to your credit card company.
'Nuff said.
If you paid for insurance then it is the seller's responsibility to
deliver proof of it to you in case the item gets lost so that you can
recover the value of the purchase from the shipper, and apparently the
cost of shipping from the seller as well. Things do get lost, stolen,
misdelivered or very significantly delayed on occasion through no fault
of either the seller or the buyer. It would appear solely from your
description that you do not have sufficient evidence to convict the
seller of fraud.
If for some reason the seller did not in fact obtain the insurance on
the parcel when it was sent then without doubt it is the seller's
responsibility to make good for the loss. IF the seller has tried to
nickel-and-dime you on an insurance fee then that is a calculated risk
that the seller has undertaken for his own benefit, in the likelihood
that most packages do not in fact get lost. No harm done PROVIDED that
the seller honestly admits having done so and makes you whole again.
Perhaps you are dealing with an inexperienced businessperson on the
seller's end, one who, if he/she were to continue to displease customers
such as yourself might not last long in a commercial enterprise.
J.
Enoch Root wrote:
> The ad
> specifically says I'm paying for insurance in addition to shipping with
> that $10.