Hi,
It is highly likely my question has been done here before. I'm a bit of
a novice to furniture making, I've been doing a night school at the
polytechnic down here in Christchurch, New Zealand, for about 12
months.
It's fair to say I'm hooked. I cannot believe what I can produce with
the machinery available and some expert guidance. It's fair to say I
have been spoilt by using huge saws and jointers and thicknessers.
Projects so far include a bedside table (beech), bookcase (white
oak),outdoor table (macrocarpa).
I have now developed a curiosity with the question "How easy would it
be to learn how to mill and joint boards by hand?"
I have just bought a second hand Stanley No.5 and read up on tuning it
andsharpening (scary sharp).
I am intrigued by how much of what I have done at night school can be
doneat home with hand tools without spending ten times as much time on
it.
My question is "Am I on a hiding to nothing if I attempt to prepare
andjoint some rough timber with this plane alone?" I won't be buying a
Lie Nielsen until I'm sure I will use it!! Should I at least be getting
a new blade (eg Ron Hock) for my Stanley plane. I don't want to put
myself offjust because I haven't even got what you guys would call an
entry level
tool.
I am partly intrigued as to how possible it is for a novice to learn
this.
Also machines are really expensive here.
Any advice welcome.
Pete
Hi Pete,
Well, I'm jealous. I'd love to take some classes. Anyway, on to your
question. You can actually do quite a bit with a #5. You can use as a
scrub plane (to remove alot of wood) if you camber the iron (alot, take
a look at a scrub plane iron) and set the mouth wide. You can use it
to flatten the surface of a board after scrubbing by using a sligthly
cambered iron and medium set mouth. Then you can use it to smooth the
board with an ever so slightly cambered iron and a tight mouth.
But, to get it to do all of these things means it will need to be well
tuned. Check the sole for flatness. It should be flat at least across
the toe, the heel and the mouth. Flatten the back of the blade, check
the chipbreaker, etc. See here at the bottom of the page.
http://www.yesterdaystools.com/planes.htm
Many people like scary sharp, but I never got the hang of it. I use
waterstones. After a couple of projects you'll realize how nice it
would be to have a #4 smoother, a jointer, a block plane, a scrub
plane, etc. Don't give up. One thing to listen for when planing is
that a sharp blade (not a scrub) will make a distinctive slicing sound,
almost like a z-z-z-z-z or sh-sh-sh-sh. If you don't hear it, practice
your sharpening.
I mill alot of my lumber by hand, sometimes straight from the rough
lumber, sometimes after rough dimensioning with a bandsaw. I always
smooth plane my projects. My #5 gets alot of use. Be sure to use wax
or something on the bottom as you plane to lessen the friction. I use
car wax, just dab a little on as you go.
HTH
jimg
PeteD wrote:
> Hi,
>
> It is highly likely my question has been done here before. I'm a bit of
> a novice to furniture making, I've been doing a night school at the
> polytechnic down here in Christchurch, New Zealand, for about 12
> months.
>
> It's fair to say I'm hooked. I cannot believe what I can produce with
> the machinery available and some expert guidance. It's fair to say I
> have been spoilt by using huge saws and jointers and thicknessers.
>
> Projects so far include a bedside table (beech), bookcase (white
> oak),outdoor table (macrocarpa).
>
> I have now developed a curiosity with the question "How easy would it
> be to learn how to mill and joint boards by hand?"
>
> I have just bought a second hand Stanley No.5 and read up on tuning it
> andsharpening (scary sharp).
>
> I am intrigued by how much of what I have done at night school can be
> doneat home with hand tools without spending ten times as much time on
> it.
>
> My question is "Am I on a hiding to nothing if I attempt to prepare
> andjoint some rough timber with this plane alone?" I won't be buying a
> Lie Nielsen until I'm sure I will use it!! Should I at least be getting
> a new blade (eg Ron Hock) for my Stanley plane. I don't want to put
> myself offjust because I haven't even got what you guys would call an
> entry level
> tool.
>
> I am partly intrigued as to how possible it is for a novice to learn
> this.
> Also machines are really expensive here.
>
> Any advice welcome.
>
> Pete
"Dave in Fairfax" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> PeteD wrote:
> snip
> > I have now developed a curiosity with the question "How easy would it
> > be to learn how to mill and joint boards by hand?"
> > I have just bought a second hand Stanley No.5 and read up on tuning it
> > andsharpening (scary sharp).
>
> You need to take a look at Jeff's website for info on fettling your
> planes since I suspect that you're buying new Stanleys not old ones.
> Dave in Fairfax
> --
And that would be here: http://www.amgron.clara.net/
--
********
Bill Pounds
http://www.billpounds.com
It would appear that I'm not the only one that buffs with a shoe brush. Do
the table saw and scroll saw this way all the time.
"AAvK" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:dF2xe.14457$ro.6496@fed1read02...
>
> > Be sure to use wax
> > or something on the bottom as you plane to lessen the friction. I use
> > car wax, just dab a little on as you go.
> >
> > HTH
> >
> >
> As far as waxing the sole with car wax, it absolutely must NOT contain
silicone.
> Silicone, once in your wood fibers, becomes the enemy of finishing, it
destroys
> the capability of wood to accept any liquid finishing products.
>
> A metal polish:
> To make a protective coating and polish for metal, mix turpentine (8
parts),
> beeswax (1 part), and boiled linseed oil (1/2 part)*. This mixture also
makes
> a good lubricant for saw blades and tablesaw tops. After applying with a
cloth
> and it dries, brush out with a shoe brush.
>
> --
> Alex - newbie_neander in woodworking
> cravdraa_at-yahoo_dot-com
> not my site: http://www.e-sword.net/
>
>
PeteD wrote:
snip
> I have now developed a curiosity with the question "How easy would it
> be to learn how to mill and joint boards by hand?"
> I have just bought a second hand Stanley No.5 and read up on tuning it
> andsharpening (scary sharp).
> My question is "Am I on a hiding to nothing if I attempt to prepare
> andjoint some rough timber with this plane alone?" I won't be buying a
> Lie Nielsen until I'm sure I will use it!! Should I at least be getting
> a new blade (eg Ron Hock) for my Stanley plane. I don't want to put
> myself offjust because I haven't even got what you guys would call an
> entry level
> tool.
You need to take a look at Jeff's website for info on fettling your
planes since I suspect that you're buying new Stanleys not old ones.
Flattening the surface of the boards after jointing them will take some
practice, jointing them will take a shooting board. You're right, we
have been over this in the past, but everything here is cyclical. You
can look for shooting booard pics in the archives, or I can post a pic
of mine over on ABPW. You'll need to become proficient in sharpening
your planes. There are a bunch of ways to do this, different people
have different views on which work best. The #5 is a very useful plane,
but you'll need both larger and smaller as well. Flattening with a #5
is problematic, smoothing is very difficult, at least for me. I'd
recommend adding a #7 and a #3 or #4 as well. This depends on your size
as well. If you're a bigger guy, move the number up one, if you're
smaller, decrease the numbers by one. 3,5,7 or 4,6,8 in other words.
Shooting boards work best on a bench, and can be used for ends as well
as edges, BTW, the shooting board used may need to change though. I use
a 5' board to joint edges and a shorter on for ends. YMMV
Dave in Fairfax
--
reply-to doesn't work
use:
daveldr at att dot net
American Association of Woodturners
http://www.woodturner.org
Capital Area Woodturners
http://www.capwoodturners.org/
PATINA
http://www.patinatools.org
Pounds on Wood wrote:
> And that would be here: http://www.amgron.clara.net/
Thanks, the shooting board is over on ABPW under Plane technology -
shooting board.
Dave in Fairfax
--
reply-to doesn't work
use:
daveldr at att dot net
American Association of Woodturners
http://www.woodturner.org
Capital Area Woodturners
http://www.capwoodturners.org/
PATINA
http://www.patinatools.org
On 30 Jun 2005 18:45:51 -0700, "PeteD" <[email protected]>
wrote:
>I am intrigued by how much of what I have done at night school can be
>doneat home with hand tools without spending ten times as much time on
>it.
There is a lot you can do with hand tools, but I probably wouldn't
recommend surfacing lumber as a good first one to learn. To me, I
think you'd be much better served to stick with s4s and get straight
to the building. For me I get a lot more satisfaction from doing the
joinery than making a not so flat board flat. I won't deny planes are
fun to use, but I use them enough without doing the surfacing. I
think you'd get more bang for your buck learning to mortise & tenon or
dovetails.
I am still getting a hang of using the planes myself. I find it hard
to get flat surfaces. I always seem to take off more on one side or
corner. I am sure my technique will improve over time, but I just
don't find the process enjoyable. I think it would be difficult to
try to complete a project until you've mastered it, as boards that
aren't square and aren't a consistent thickness are going to wreck
havoc. Having the plane(s) does make dealing with presurfaced lumber
easier, as any boards that have warped you can get back into shape.
Also, after a full afternoon of planing the way your hands / arms /
shoulders / back are going to feel the price of a jointer/planer will
start looking better...
-Leuf
"PeteD" <[email protected]> wrote in news:1120182351.908201.175550
@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com:
<snip>
> My question is "Am I on a hiding to nothing if I attempt to prepare
> andjoint some rough timber with this plane alone?" I won't be buying a
> Lie Nielsen until I'm sure I will use it!! Should I at least be getting
> a new blade (eg Ron Hock) for my Stanley plane. I don't want to put
> myself offjust because I haven't even got what you guys would call an
> entry level
> tool.
>
You have the plane, and you have a few resources on how to tune it up. Now
make a smallish, fairly simple project, using just the tools you have on
hand, at home.
Small boxes, tables, benches and stools come immediately to mind. Check at
the library for some inspiration in the magazines. Don't be too ambitious
at first, because this is a learning experience, not a 'showpiece'. Find
some easy to work wood, and have a go at it. This small, inexpensive
project, whatever it is, will teach you more about what is possible than
anything we can teach you over Usenet.
When you're done with it, take it to one of your trusted instructors, and
ask how you might improve your hand tool skills in the next project.
You'll likely get some really good pointers.
Welcome to the quiet side.
Patriarch
> Be sure to use wax
> or something on the bottom as you plane to lessen the friction. I use
> car wax, just dab a little on as you go.
>
> HTH
>
>
As far as waxing the sole with car wax, it absolutely must NOT contain silicone.
Silicone, once in your wood fibers, becomes the enemy of finishing, it destroys
the capability of wood to accept any liquid finishing products.
A metal polish:
To make a protective coating and polish for metal, mix turpentine (8 parts),
beeswax (1 part), and boiled linseed oil (1/2 part)*. This mixture also makes
a good lubricant for saw blades and tablesaw tops. After applying with a cloth
and it dries, brush out with a shoe brush.
--
Alex - newbie_neander in woodworking
cravdraa_at-yahoo_dot-com
not my site: http://www.e-sword.net/
On Thu, 30 Jun 2005 19:47:57 -0700, jimg wrote:
> I use
> car wax, just dab a little on as you go.
Whoops. Lose the car wax. It contains silicone, which will screw up your
finish later. Use paraffin wax, beeswax, or one of several cabinet waxes;
just don't use anything with silicone compounds.
--
"Keep your ass behind you"
vladimir a t mad {dot} scientist {dot} com
On 30 Jun 2005 18:45:51 -0700, "PeteD" <[email protected]>
wrote:
>My question is "Am I on a hiding to nothing if I attempt to prepare
>andjoint some rough timber with this plane alone?"
Yes. It's a question of time, not technique.
If you _want_ to flatten boards by hand, then go for it. You should
certainly learn to do it, just for the experience. But if you're trying
to earn money by making things, then flatten them on the quick, easy
machine, not the slow skill-dependent hand plane.
Even if you're making medieval repro, machine the boards flat first,
then hand plane them again to put a hand-worked texture on them. It
gives the same finish, but it's quicker.
> I won't be buying a Lie Nielsen until I'm sure I will use it!!
Not for flattening boards anyway - well, maybe the #40 scrub plane.
What you want is another yard-sale Stanley #4. Working order, but this
is a good way to use up a rough modern one. Grind the iron into the
deep curve of a scrub plane with a fairly blunt (35°) angle on it - a
modern Stanley iron is good for this (it's good for little else) as it
doesn't need to be that perfectly sharp. Adjust the frog backwards (but
not beyond the rear edge of the mouth) and maybe even file the forward
mouth edge open further.
Now get some boards of cheap larch (or whatever), and flatten them by
hand. Practice on something easy to plane (soft, but stable)
Make yourself some winding sticks too.
>Should I at least be getting
>a new blade (eg Ron Hock) for my Stanley plane.
If you're after good bench planes, then improved blades are worth
having. Stanley Sweetheart (1920s) are a good idea, as eBay shopping
will often turn them up with attached planes. Personally I buy new
Samurai brand, another laminated iron, or Clifton Victor, probably the
thickest and most stable you can fit into a Stanley. I don't like Hock
myself (search this ng).
>I haven't even got what you guys would call an entry level tool.
You need a basic benchful, but you don't need to spend much to get them.
Second hand is the trick.