Luckily not me this time.
Some local was using a Circular saw and cut off his entire hand at the
wrist. Still trying to figure out how that was done. Fingers I see but a
whole hand?
Anyway his friends had enough sense to put the hand on ice, tourniquet his
arm, and rush him to the hospital. The hand has been reattached but the
doctor says he has months of rehabilitation ahead of him.
--
George wrote:
> Would that be significantly different from the saline solutions sold to
> contact lens wearers?
I'm not sure what they sell for contact users. FWIW, normal saline is 0.9%.
It's called "normal" because it's the same concentration of salt normally found
in blood.
--
Mortimer Schnerd, RN
[email protected]
http://www.mortimerschnerd.com
OMG, my nightmare come true, only for someone else. I think I'll buy
some more clamps and hold downs for my miter saw.
On Sun, 15 Feb 2004 13:49:50 -0500, "Young_carpenter"
<[email protected]> wrote:
>Luckily not me this time.
>Some local was using a Circular saw and cut off his entire hand at the
>wrist. Still trying to figure out how that was done. Fingers I see but a
>whole hand?
>Anyway his friends had enough sense to put the hand on ice, tourniquet his
>arm, and rush him to the hospital. The hand has been reattached but the
>doctor says he has months of rehabilitation ahead of him.
Would that be significantly different from the saline solutions sold to
contact lens wearers?
"Mortimer Schnerd, RN" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> Rather than putting a severed part directly on ice, you'd do much better
to
> stick it in a baggy and float it in a bucket of ice water. Ice can cause
> further tissue damage that ice water won't. In the best of all worlds,
I'd pour
> some normal saline in the bag, but I don't keep any around the house.
>
>
>
> --
> Mortimer Schnerd, RN
>
> [email protected]
> http://www.mortimerschnerd.com
>
>
"Young_carpenter" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Luckily not me this time.
> Some local was using a Circular saw and cut off his entire hand at the
> wrist. Still trying to figure out how that was done. Fingers I see but a
> whole hand?
> Anyway his friends had enough sense to put the hand on ice, tourniquet his
> arm, and rush him to the hospital. The hand has been reattached but the
> doctor says he has months of rehabilitation ahead of him.
>
If this was the incident that happend in Northern Michigan last week, I
think he was using a compound miter saw to cut some trim and was reaching
across the saw to hold the stock. It was his left hand that was severed.
His wife was the one who brought the hand with them to the hospital. I
agree that it seems like it would be hard to cut off your whole hand. The
article said that he did not feel any pain after it was cut off! Reading
about this sort of thing makes me VERY careful when working around blades.
Btw, young carpenter, I live in T.C., where are you from?
Jswee
Curmudgeon in Training
George wrote:
> Would that be significantly different from the saline solutions sold to
> contact lens wearers?
No, but you'd need a lot of the little bottles. A couple of Tablespoons
of table salt in a quart of water will give you a close enough mix. As
I remember. it's been about 15 years. Does that sound about right
Mortimer?
Dave in Fairfax
--
reply-to doesn't work
use:
daveldr at att dot net
American Association of Woodturners
http://www.woodturner.org
Capital Area Woodturners
http://www.capwoodturners.org/
Young_carpenter wrote:
> Anyway his friends had enough sense to put the hand on ice, tourniquet his
> arm, and rush him to the hospital. The hand has been reattached but the
> doctor says he has months of rehabilitation ahead of him.
Rather than putting a severed part directly on ice, you'd do much better to
stick it in a baggy and float it in a bucket of ice water. Ice can cause
further tissue damage that ice water won't. In the best of all worlds, I'd pour
some normal saline in the bag, but I don't keep any around the house.
--
Mortimer Schnerd, RN
[email protected]
http://www.mortimerschnerd.com
And probably facing hundreds of thousands of dollars in medical bills
John
On Sun, 15 Feb 2004 13:49:50 -0500, "Young_carpenter"
<[email protected]> wrote:
>Luckily not me this time.
>Some local was using a Circular saw and cut off his entire hand at the
>wrist. Still trying to figure out how that was done. Fingers I see but a
>whole hand?
>Anyway his friends had enough sense to put the hand on ice, tourniquet his
>arm, and rush him to the hospital. The hand has been reattached but the
>doctor says he has months of rehabilitation ahead of him.
Yikes,
Don't remind me. Area insurance is the highest in the state, (the county is
the highest in the area) and the state has some of the highest in the
country.
--
"Charlie Self" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> John Crea notes:
>
> >And probably facing hundreds of thousands of dollars in medical bills
> >
>
> Or his insurance company is. Think what that does to YOUR medical
insurance
> premiums.
>
> Charlie Self
> "Health food makes me sick." Calvin Trillin
>
> http://hometown.aol.com/charliediy/myhomepage/business.html
Or if NOT insured, think what it is doing to the local taxes in the
county/city where it happened
On 16 Feb 2004 00:22:10 GMT, [email protected] (Charlie Self)
wrote:
>John Crea notes:
>
>>And probably facing hundreds of thousands of dollars in medical bills
>>
>
>Or his insurance company is. Think what that does to YOUR medical insurance
>premiums.
>
>Charlie Self
>"Health food makes me sick." Calvin Trillin
>
>http://hometown.aol.com/charliediy/myhomepage/business.html
John Crea responds:
>Or if NOT insured, think what it is doing to the local taxes in the
>county/city where it happened
>
>On 16 Feb 2004 00:22:10 GMT, [email protected] (Charlie Self)
>wrote:
>
>>John Crea notes:
>>
>>>And probably facing hundreds of thousands of dollars in medical bills
>>>
>>
>>Or his insurance company is. Think what that does to YOUR medical insurance
>>premiums.
Huh? How is tax money involved?
Charlie Self
"Health food makes me sick." Calvin Trillin
http://hometown.aol.com/charliediy/myhomepage/business.html
"Mortimer Schnerd, RN" wrote:
> Charlie Self wrote:
> > Huh? How is tax money involved?
> My place of employment is considered the "county" hospital. As such, we turn no
> one away, whether they have insurance or not. The county picks up the bills for
> those without insurance. Guess who picks up the county's bills?
We're a non-profit as well. Last time I checked we were giving away
about $16mil a year. We all pay for it, and that's why nurses at
Community and non-profits get paid less than at not-for or for-profit
hospitals. Just an FYI.
Dave in Fairfax
--
reply-to doesn't work
use:
daveldr at att dot net
American Association of Woodturners
http://www.woodturner.org
Capital Area Woodturners
http://www.capwoodturners.org/
"Mortimer Schnerd, RN" <[email protected]> wrote in
news:[email protected]:
> My place of employment is considered the "county" hospital. As such,
> we turn no one away, whether they have insurance or not. The county
> picks up the bills for those without insurance. Guess who picks up
> the county's bills?
>
Whether it is insurance or the county that pays the costs, "premiums" will
need to go up to cover the costs.
--
Best regards
Han
email address is invalid
Charlie Self wrote:
> Huh? How is tax money involved?
My place of employment is considered the "county" hospital. As such, we turn no
one away, whether they have insurance or not. The county picks up the bills for
those without insurance. Guess who picks up the county's bills?
--
Mortimer Schnerd, RN
[email protected]
http://www.mortimerschnerd.com
Charlie
Who do you think PAYS for the care of the uninsured when they run up
bills in the hundreds of thousands of dollars?? Hospital bills are
often written OFF as uncollectable, and in county/city hospitals they
are subsidised/funded by your taxes
Also, if un-insured, there may be NO rehab as many/most of the rehab
centers will NOT admit you without a payment means, so we get someone
with a non-functioning hand who may often be a tax burden in many
cases
John
\
n 16 Feb 2004 09:17:47 GMT, [email protected] (Charlie Self)
wrote:
>John Crea responds:
>
>>Or if NOT insured, think what it is doing to the local taxes in the
>>county/city where it happened
>>
>>On 16 Feb 2004 00:22:10 GMT, [email protected] (Charlie Self)
>>wrote:
>>
>>>John Crea notes:
>>>
>>>>And probably facing hundreds of thousands of dollars in medical bills
>>>>
>>>
>>>Or his insurance company is. Think what that does to YOUR medical insurance
>>>premiums.
>
>Huh? How is tax money involved?
>
>Charlie Self
>"Health food makes me sick." Calvin Trillin
>
>http://hometown.aol.com/charliediy/myhomepage/business.html
Charlie Self wrote:
>
> I'd guess in some cases, the hospital gets to eat part of the bill,
> in other cases we do.
It may seem that way on the surface, but they would not exist doing
charitable work all the time. We pay either in goverment subsidies or
higher insurance premiums for the rest of us. There is no FREE healthcare.
If too many people can't pay, the price of an aspirin will go from $4 to $6.
--
Ed
[email protected]
http://pages.cthome.net/edhome
John Crea writes:
>Charlie
>
>Who do you think PAYS for the care of the uninsured when they run up
>bills in the hundreds of thousands of dollars?? Hospital bills are
>often written OFF as uncollectable, and in county/city hospitals they
>are subsidised/funded by your taxes
I'd say the hospital gets a tax deduction for non-payment, in some cases, but I
don't know how it works for non-profits. I know how it works for me. I don't
get paid for an article, I can deduct my expenses. The rest, I get to eat.
I'd guess in some cases, the hospital gets to eat part of the bill, in other
cases we do.
Charlie Self
"Health food makes me sick." Calvin Trillin
http://hometown.aol.com/charliediy/myhomepage/business.html
Edwin Pawlowski wrote:
> healthcare. If too many people can't pay, the price of an aspirin will go
> from $4 to $6.
Hell's bells, it was already $40 the last time I was in a hospital.
--
Michael McIntyre ---- Silvan <[email protected]>
Linux fanatic, and certified Geek; registered Linux user #243621
http://www.geocities.com/Paris/Rue/5407/
On Sun, 15 Feb 2004 19:02:24 GMT, "Mortimer Schnerd, RN"
<[email protected]> wrote:
> In the best of all worlds, I'd pour
>some normal saline in the bag, but I don't keep any around the house.
Would the contents of a fresh, sealed eye wash bottle work? I have
those, and if they would work, it would be nice to know. Just in
case.
Barry
On 2004/2/15 5:16 PM, "Jswee" <[email protected]> wrote:
> If this was the incident that happend in Northern Michigan last week, I
> think he was using a compound miter saw to cut some trim and was reaching
> across the saw to hold the stock. It was his left hand that was severed.
It takes only a brief moment of inattention (or stupidity) to cause an
accident that changes lives.
> His wife was the one who brought the hand with them to the hospital.
If so, his wife deserves a lot of credit. It is very difficult to think
clearly at a time like that.
> The
> article said that he did not feel any pain after it was cut off!
Quite believable. The pain may come later after the shock and disbelieve
wear off. I lost the end of my index finger about three years ago. I closed
a car door on it. The end of my finger was crushed and all the flesh pulled
off. It did not hurt. In fact, I did not realize that I had seriously
injured myself until I saw the bone sticking out.
> Btw, young carpenter, I live in T.C., where are you from?
Where is that? I am a troll from the L.P. Myself.
Bob Haar writes:
>
>> If this was the incident that happend in Northern Michigan last week, I
>> think he was using a compound miter saw to cut some trim and was reaching
>> across the saw to hold the stock. It was his left hand that was severed.
>
>It takes only a brief moment of inattention (or stupidity) to cause an
>accident that changes lives.
I think this qualifies as more than a "brief moment" of stupidity or anything
else. I mean, come on. The guy first crosses his arm under the blade and leaves
it there as he lowers the blade. He then brings the blade down and through his
wrist. Maybe 7-1/2" diameter wrist, with bones.
That's a complete cut-out of the brain on at least a temporary basis, with or
without pain.
Charlie Self
"Health food makes me sick." Calvin Trillin
http://hometown.aol.com/charliediy/myhomepage/business.html
[email protected] (Charlie Self) wrote:
>wrist. Maybe 7-1/2" diameter wrist, with bones.
Was this Andre the Giant? My wrist is probably only 7-1/2" in
circumference!
--
Alex
Make the obvious change in the return address to reply by email.
alexy responds:
>[email protected] (Charlie Self) wrote:
>
>>wrist. Maybe 7-1/2" diameter wrist, with bones.
>
>Was this Andre the Giant? My wrist is probably only 7-1/2" in
>circumference!
Sorry about that. Doesn't exactly alter the point, does it?
Charlie Self
"Health food makes me sick." Calvin Trillin
http://hometown.aol.com/charliediy/myhomepage/business.html
[email protected] (Charlie Self) wrote:
>alexy responds:
>
>>[email protected] (Charlie Self) wrote:
>>
>>>wrist. Maybe 7-1/2" diameter wrist, with bones.
>>
>>Was this Andre the Giant? My wrist is probably only 7-1/2" in
>>circumference!
>
>Sorry about that. Doesn't exactly alter the point, does it?
No, and I should have included a smiley to acknowledge that! I accept
a slap on my [skinny] wrist.
--
Alex
Make the obvious change in the return address to reply by email.
7-1/2" diameter wrist? What is this guy, the Hulk in full green mode? My
wrist is less than 2.5" at it's widest. In any case, I agree that this was a
little more than stupid.
"Charlie Self" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> >
> Maybe 7-1/2" diameter wrist, with bones.
>
CW responds:
>
>7-1/2" diameter wrist? What is this guy, the Hulk in full green mode? My
>wrist is less than 2.5" at it's widest. In any case, I agree that this was a
>little more than stupid.
>"Charlie Self" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:[email protected]...
>> >
>
>> Maybe 7-1/2" diameter wrist, with bones.
>>
I think I wrote that about 4 a.m., after being up a whole 10 minutes. Sorry.
Charlie Self
"Health food makes me sick." Calvin Trillin
http://hometown.aol.com/charliediy/myhomepage/business.html
No problem Charlie. I should have included a couple of :) :). It was
obvious you were not up to usual.
"Charlie Self" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> CW responds:
>
> >
> >7-1/2" diameter wrist? What is this guy, the Hulk in full green mode? My
> >wrist is less than 2.5" at it's widest. In any case, I agree that this
was a
> >little more than stupid.
> >"Charlie Self" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> >news:[email protected]...
> >> >
> >
> >> Maybe 7-1/2" diameter wrist, with bones.
> >>
> I think I wrote that about 4 a.m., after being up a whole 10 minutes.
Sorry.
>
> Charlie Self
> "Health food makes me sick." Calvin Trillin
>
> http://hometown.aol.com/charliediy/myhomepage/business.html
I'd like to see the toxicology tests after that one. If this happened
in Florida, he'd be peeing in a cup for sure, but many states are
behind in this area. When tested, 60% of lost-time injuries are found
to be alcohol/drug related.
Also, thanks Morty for explaining normal saline. I worked at a
company for three years which sold this stuff, and had no idea what
that meant. I always assumed it meant just salt and water with no
additives.
Cheers
Joe
>
> That's a complete cut-out of the brain on at least a temporary basis, with or
> without pain.
>
> Charlie Self
> "Health food makes me sick." Calvin Trillin
>
> http://hometown.aol.com/charliediy/myhomepage/business.html
I believe this is regional and I am almost sure they said circular saw. I
live in C.N.Y/F.L.R
--
"Jswee" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> "Young_carpenter" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> > Luckily not me this time.
> > Some local was using a Circular saw and cut off his entire hand at the
> > wrist. Still trying to figure out how that was done. Fingers I see but
a
> > whole hand?
> > Anyway his friends had enough sense to put the hand on ice, tourniquet
his
> > arm, and rush him to the hospital. The hand has been reattached but the
> > doctor says he has months of rehabilitation ahead of him.
> >
> If this was the incident that happend in Northern Michigan last week, I
> think he was using a compound miter saw to cut some trim and was reaching
> across the saw to hold the stock. It was his left hand that was severed.
> His wife was the one who brought the hand with them to the hospital. I
> agree that it seems like it would be hard to cut off your whole hand. The
> article said that he did not feel any pain after it was cut off! Reading
> about this sort of thing makes me VERY careful when working around blades.
> Btw, young carpenter, I live in T.C., where are you from?
>
> Jswee
> Curmudgeon in Training
>
>
B a r r y B u r k e J r . wrote:
>> In the best of all worlds, I'd pour
>> some normal saline in the bag, but I don't keep any around the house.
>
> Would the contents of a fresh, sealed eye wash bottle work? I have
> those, and if they would work, it would be nice to know. Just in
> case.
Since my last comment, I did a google search on "saline for eye wash". I
immediately got a hit that indicates it should work just fine. Apparently, eye
wash IS 0.9% saline solution, ie, "normal" or "isotonic".
Save up those fingers and toes! You're ready!
--
Mortimer Schnerd, RN
[email protected]
http://www.mortimerschnerd.com
"Jswee" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> "Young_carpenter" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> > ...
> > Some local was using a Circular saw and cut off his entire hand at the
> > wrist. Still trying to figure out how that was done. Fingers I see but a
> > whole hand? ...
> >
> If this was the incident that happend in Northern Michigan last week, I
> think he was using a compound miter saw to cut some trim and was reaching
> across the saw to hold the stock. It was his left hand that was severed.
> His wife was the one who brought the hand with them to the hospital. I
> agree that it seems like it would be hard to cut off your whole hand.
> ...
When I was taught how to use a radial arm saw I was told the most
common accident with it was amputation of the left thumb. The second
most common was blunt trauma to the chest or shoulder, often with
a dislocation, due to kickback (perhaps 'kickforward' since a RAS cuts
with a climbing cut). This comes about from right-handed people
using their right hand on the handle on the right side of the saw,
and holding the stock with their left hand so that their body is
in line with the blade and they reach accros their body to
steady short pieces.
To avoid injury, I was taught to use the tool left handed, that is
with my left hand operating the saw and my right hand holding
the stock. This puts the 'stock' hand really far from the
blade and your body to the right of saw instead of in line
with the blade. It sounds awkward, but if you do it that
way you'll immediately see the advantage. I wish Nahrm
would give it a try that way.
A sliding CMS can be used the same way, although often the
trigger switch is designed for right hand use. Also, a
sliding CMS can be used by pulling it out past the stock,
then plunging it down, and then pushing it back through the
stock like a normal circular saw so as to not do a climbing
cut. I'm interested in opinions on that.
One problem I have had with a sliding CMS is misaligment
of the fence extensions with the fence resulting in kickback
upon completing the cut, regardless of which direction you
cut. No, I didn't set that saw up, but now I always check
to be sure the stock is flush with the factory fence on the
saw befor cutting. The same thing can happen if the stock
being cut is crooked, not properly jointed on the edge
against the fence.
--
FF
Fredfighter notes:
>When I was taught how to use a radial arm saw I was told the most
>common accident with it was amputation of the left thumb. The second
>most common was blunt trauma to the chest or shoulder, often with
>a dislocation, due to kickback (perhaps 'kickforward' since a RAS cuts
>with a climbing cut). This comes about from right-handed people
>using their right hand on the handle on the right side of the saw,
>and holding the stock with their left hand so that their body is
>in line with the blade and they reach accros their body to
>steady short pieces.
Lemmee tell ya about--do NOT use the RAS to cut OSB. I had a piece shatter when
I was cutting it, and it was 10 minutes before I realized my right pinkie was
pumping blood from a split to the bone. The other piece caught me in a very
sensitive spot and I spent that 10 minutes bent over, whooping and whining
before I noticed blood all over the damned place. I had hunched my way from the
back porch (location of a saw that left my possession as quickly as I could
clean the blood off) to the kitchen, which fortunately had glossy paint on the
walls and linoleum on the floor (old farmhouse kitchen really had linoleum).
I won't even set a piece of OSB down near an RAS now.
Charlie Self
"Health food makes me sick." Calvin Trillin
http://hometown.aol.com/charliediy/myhomepage/business.html
Young_carpenter wrote:
> Luckily not me this time.
> Some local was using a Circular saw and cut off his entire hand at the
> wrist. Still trying to figure out how that was done. Fingers I see
> but a whole hand?
A college roommate had a good start at doing that. He was a building
contractor (before coming back to college to get an electrical engineering
degree -- doesn't require strength in both arms...) and to "save time" he
always worked with the circular saw guard pinned back. After several years
of that nonsense statistics finally caught up with him and he had a bad
kickback. The wide scar went from his wrist to almost the elbow. It was
deep enough the bone was partially severed.
The guard would in all probability kept him from anything more than
scratches and bruises, he said.
-- Mark